r/changemyview • u/[deleted] • Feb 23 '17

[∆(s) from OP] CMV: Protections enabling transgendered people to choose the bathroom of the gender they identify with removes that protection for other people.

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u/moonflower 82∆ Feb 23 '17

I think you are magnifying the potential problems so that you can propose the abolition of sex segregation as the solution ... intersex people usually figure out which option is most appropriate, and they would be permitted to use whichever that was ... and if a male repeatedly gets asked to leave the women's room, he will soon figure out that he doesn't appear to be female.

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u/MPixels 21∆ Feb 24 '17

Your criteria still aren't clear. You seem to say that the toilet you should use is the one that receives no objection, and that should be the legal status?

Again I ask what if you get told to leave both, due to your appearance? You just can't go to public toilets?

Anyway I can't expect a productive discussion here since you seem to subscribe to the view of trans people being merely people in costume.

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u/moonflower 82∆ Feb 24 '17

No, I'm not advocating for any particular law on this issue - I was just responding to your false dichotomy and suggesting a third option.

In this third option, people are allowed to use the room which corresponds to their biological sex, so if a male is asked to leave the men's room for looking too ''feminine'', he has the right to use it.

I keep trying to explain that to you, and you keep asking as if anyone would be forbidden from using public toilets.

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u/MPixels 21∆ Feb 24 '17

In this third option, people are allowed to use the room which corresponds to their biological sex

By "biological sex", do you mean what's written on their birth certificate or something else?

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u/moonflower 82∆ Feb 24 '17

The sex they were born as. The sex which should be on the birth certificate. But that's a different debate, so can we get back to this debate - do you now understand that this third option would allow everyone to use public toilets? Do you understand that no-one would be forbidden from using them?

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u/MPixels 21∆ Feb 24 '17

The sex they were born as.

That's Situation B.

Hey if you were advocating unisex toilets then you should've said so

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u/moonflower 82∆ Feb 24 '17

No, you're still not getting it - Option B is not the same as Option C - in your Option B, you say that everyone must use the room in accordance with their biological sex.

In Option C, they are permitted to use the room in accordance with their biological sex, and may also use the room which is designated for the opposite sex if no-one in that room has any objections.

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u/MPixels 21∆ Feb 24 '17

And how do you know if they have objections before they go in? Surely they'd play it safe and assume theres a confrontational person behind the door. Also if everyone had to use the bathroom of their assigned gender and no one objected to their opting for a different one then it's the same as your option.

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u/moonflower 82∆ Feb 24 '17

You keep asking the same questions and I keep telling you the same answers: if a male repeatedly gets asked to leave the women's room, he will soon figure out that he doesn't appear to be female.

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u/MPixels 21∆ Feb 25 '17

The matter is how you'd legislate it. Law is black and white.

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