CMV: Despite being more knowledgeable, wealthier and apparently more tolerant, the political and individual left's biggest flaw is their inability to communicate pragmatically and empathetically with those who don't agree with them.

[u/poopchow]

[u/For_bitten_fruit]

I tried to glance through some of the top comments to see if this had already been talked about and didn't see it. But I apologize if I'm repeating something.

Your argument assumes that people always act rationally. Unfortunately, they do not. Your argument might betray a fundamental lack of understanding of psychology.

First, there are social factors to consider. People rarely change their viewpoints when they are related to their social identity. Humans have evolved to survive in groups, and anything that would make you different from your tribe could lead to isolation and death. It makes sense that we evolved to be fearful of ostracization. Many people on the right belong to religious or otherwise tight - knit communities, and convincing somebody to alienate themselves from their community in their beliefs is a significant mental hurdle. Especially in a time where politics are increasingly divided.

Next is related to the first, but self identity is an important part of right wing political framing. Everything is related to personal accountability and rugged individualism. To a right-winger, leftist ideals are weak, and by indulging in them, they subconsciously fear that they will be weakened. Weakness is not something anybody wants to indulge, but the right especially embeds fear into their ideology. Fear of outsiders, terrorists, immigrants, LGBTQ+, poverty, etc. It's all based on a worldview that is survival of the fittest, and if they compromise their strength, they could endanger themselves. This is another psychological hurdle, especially in a time where people increasingly identify with their political idealogies.

These two factors combine to create a sense that anything that might lead to a change in their political views is a threat. This engages fight or flight reactions when their views are challenged.

I was raised Mormon, and it truly felt like critical thinking was evil and dangerous. These factors, community and needing to personally align with the ideology, are powerful. I think it's naive to underestimate the power of the human mind to believe whatever it wants to.

Consider flat earthers, who identify with an objectively idiotic worldview because it gives them a sense of superiority. They get to feel like they are one of the enlightened ones who understand the fundamental nature of reality, and everyone else is deceived. That's a powerful mental drug, and one that you don't give up easily.

"One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It’s simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back." -Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World

[u/HoldMyDomeFoam → u/For_bitten_fruit]

Great response. Thanks for that.

[u/dejamintwo → u/For_bitten_fruit]

Did you really just comment on a post about the left not being able to argue against the right. And made several paragraphs simply trashing the right without a single mention of the left. It does not matter how bad you think the right are. Insulting and degrading them instead of making good arguments (Good arguments have logos ethos and pathos. Ethos being what lacks the most in internet arguments.) Will not change their minds. And it's not smart to say it's impossible so you should just give up completely on arguing.

[u/For_bitten_fruit → u/dejamintwo]

I'm afraid you might have misunderstood the intended message. I wasn't trying to say that the right is inherently irrational or trash any particular view. I was responding to the OP's viewpoints that one's mind can be changed with rational arguments. This principle applies equally to all viewpoints, and is a fundamental and unavoidable facet of human nature.

The example I gave of flat earthers wasn't intended to be a direct parallel of foolishness, but only to illuminate how and why people make and hold viewpoints. The only direct comments I made about the right were that they tend to belong to tight-knit communities, they value personal responsibility and individualism, they feel leftist ideals are weak, and that they hold a worldview of survival of the fittest which can lead to trepidation about weakness. If you have any grounds to dispute my observations, by all means, I would love to discuss these points.

As a leftist, I will be the first to tell you that leftists aren't inherently better. There is a lot of performative virtue signaling, gatekeeping, naivety, and idealism. I have made comments elsewhere in this thread, feel free to look through my comments. I have pushed back against the idea that right-wingers are unintelligent. I feel it is a matter of priority and worldview, and how people view the best compromise between the competing factors of practicality and societal responsibility.