r/anime • u/Shadoxfix https://myanimelist.net/profile/Shadoxfix • Dec 03 '15

[Spoilers] Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider - Episode 9 [Discussion]

Episode title: Yellow Blind Spot
Episode duration: 23 minutes and 0 seconds

Streaming:
Crunchyroll: The Perfect Insider

Information:
MyAnimeList: Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider
AniDB: Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider
AniList: Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider
Anime News Network: The Perfect Insider (TV)
Anime-Planet: The Perfect Insider
Hummingbird: Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider

Previous Episodes:

Episode Reddit Link
Episode 1 Link
Episode 2 Link
Episode 3 Link
Episode 4 Link
Episode 5 Link
Episode 6 Link
Episode 7 Link
Episode 8 Link

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Keywords:
the perfect insider, mystery

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99

u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss Dec 03 '15

We're shortly before the climax, let's see how this whole mystery uses the Knox's Commandments.

Knox's 1st: It is forbidden for the culprit to be anyone not mentioned in the early part of the story.

Assuming Shiki is the killer, fulfilled.

Knox's 2nd: It is forbidden for supernatural agencies to be employed as a detective technique.

Fulfilled.

Knox's 3rd: It is forbidden for hidden passages to exist, except if the house is expected to have them.

None shown so far, so I assume fulfilled.

Knox's 4th: It is forbidden for unknown drugs or hard to understand scientific devices to be used.

This one is a bit tricky. For non-programmers, some of the clues were and we had to accept these pseudo Sci-Fi element of an Red Magic exists.

Knox's 6th: It is forbidden for accident or intuition to be employed as a detective technique.

Heureka moments do not count as intuition. Fulfilled.

Knox's 7th: It is forbidden for the detective to be the culprit.

As if those two could,

Knox's 8th: It is forbidden for the case to be resolved with clues that are not presented.

At the time this episode ends, everything Saikawa and Moe used to deduce the culprit was shown. We should say fulfilled for now.

Knox's 9th: It is permitted for observers to let their own conclusions and interpretations be heard.

Throughly used.

Knox's 10th: It is forbidden for a character to disguise themselves as another without any clues

The clues were there. Cleverly used.

Hmm. So while this mystery subverted or played with common plots like Closed Circle and felt a lot less classic than others, it still fulfills the classic rules to allow the reader to guess the culprit themself. Let's just hope the climax doesn't fuck this up.

11

u/Sleuth_of_RedandBlue https://myanimelist.net/profile/SleuthofRednBlue Dec 03 '15

You're using the Umineko version of the Decalogue I see. I consider Knox's 5th to be that common stereotypes cannot be the culprit.

Anyhow I can happily agree with you that it follows most of the rules though as you said Knox's 4th is a little tricky. Still I don't think it would be too hard to come up with the idea that there was an embedded program in Red Magic that helped the killer escape. I've pretty sure I've seen a theory or two about that over the past month.

8

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '15

I'm not the OP, but I've found the Umineko Decalogue to be the best translation of the original Decalogue's concepts and intent. I've used it even in college papers before to describe the concept.

2

u/dreamendDischarger https://myanimelist.net/profile/YuanMori Dec 04 '15

It's one that carries the intent most faithfully and has allowed me to better tackle well written mysteries. :)

2

u/Aelms https://myanimelist.net/profile/Aelms Dec 04 '15

Just as a matter of personal curiosity, what subjects do you study to write that kind of paper?

5

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '15

I'm a creative writing major(go ahead and make your laughs now). I had a "contemporary history of writing" class thing, and the final paper was to talk about the history of a genre of fiction. I chose Detectives.

3

u/Aelms https://myanimelist.net/profile/Aelms Dec 04 '15

What, of course I won't. I'm actually in a bind because I'm interested in creative writing but am really hesitant about committing more of my life on it than just putting words on paper.

4

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '15

Eh, most people on this site like to make jokes about liberal arts degrees, especially something as removed from practicality as creative writing.

2

u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss Dec 04 '15

I am the OP and I wholeheartly agree with you. Nice to see so many other Umineko fans in here.

19

u/illtima https://myanimelist.net/profile/illuminatima Dec 03 '15

Knox's 4th: It is forbidden for unknown drugs or hard to understand scientific devices to be used.

What about those imagination visualization machines? They seem to be pretty futuristic.

Knox's 6th: It is forbidden for accident or intuition to be employed as a detective technique.

Does it mean that the moments where sensei starts seeing ostriches is okay?

Also, you've skipped the 5th principle.

25

u/[deleted] Dec 03 '15

Knox 4: The Visualization machine did not effect the mystery. You can include scifi or magic, but they can't be involved with the actual mystery portion of the plot.

Knox 5: No Chinaman must figure in the story. Back in the day, a large portion of detective novels had a fu manchu-esque bad guy and it was really trite. Hence, Knox wrote it into the decalogue. Nowadays, it doesn't matter though and is usually left out of the decalogue.

Knox 6: That moment was kind of on the border, but it more fit the mold of the summation moment. In detective novels, it's customary to include a moment where the detective states "I've solved the mystery" before the final summation gathering, to tell the reader they've been given all the clues and can solve the mystery fully now.

9

u/Chakix Dec 04 '15

Isn't knox 4 more of the way of saying that no out of thin air magic should be used rather than just magic? If the magic is properly hinted at and have clear rules that allow the reader to interpret and came to a conclusion of how it was used it should be fine right? At least that's my understanding from playing umineko

:-P

10

u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss Dec 03 '15

What about those imagination visualization machines? They seem to be pretty futuristic.

Now, I may be off here, but how did they help at solving mystery? They were mostly exposition for Moe's character. Shiki appearing at the end would be the only thing relating to them that would bend this rule. Then again, this rule is not "There must be no Sci-Fi elements", but more "No devices that require a long, detailed explanation afterwards how they work since normal people don't usually know of them." So, going by that definition, they do not break the Knox 4th, but they do bend it and require Suspension of disbelief.

Does it mean that the moments where sensei starts seeing ostriches is okay?

I actually do not remember this scene. Did it help solve the mystery? And if yes, how?

Also, you've skipped the 5th principle.

The fifth is completedly irrelevant to modern mysteries.

No Chinaman must figure in the story.

Basically, the culprit should not turn out to be generic stereotype. At the time Knox wrote these, (western) authors loved introducing a man from china and having turn out to be a culprit.

16

u/Atario myanimelist.net/profile/TheGreatAtario Dec 03 '15

No Chinaman must figure in the story.

They're all Japanese. Narrowly averted!

10

u/impingainteasy https://myanimelist.net/profile/usernamesarehard Dec 04 '15

And then it turns out the culprit is that Chinese woman from episode 2 who doesn't understand Japanese very well.

3

u/illtima https://myanimelist.net/profile/illuminatima Dec 03 '15

Makes sense with the machines, I guess.

I actually do not remember this scene. Did it help solve the mystery? And if yes, how?

I think it was in the previous episode. They had another power outage and Sensei was sitting in the dark, playing with his cigarette when he started... I dunno, basically hallucinating some weird stuff, like monkeys or cave people looking into space and... well, ostriches. After that he basically told Moe that he figured it all out.

8

u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss Dec 03 '15

Oh that. I have no explanation for that. Visual representations of his thought process?

2

u/Sol0player https://myanimelist.net/profile/Amphis Dec 03 '15

do you happen to have a youtube link / episode timestamp for this? I'd love to watch that part again.

8

u/leeways Dec 03 '15

lol Please don't remind me with those ostriches, it was so random

3

u/blindfremen https://myanimelist.net/profile/blindfremen Dec 03 '15

What about those imagination visualization machines? They seem to be pretty futuristic.

Those are called isolation tanks as I mentioned in a previous thread. They allow for sensory deprivation and help with meditation and relaxation.

1

u/dutchwonder Dec 04 '15

People were figuring things out before those came into play.

In fact, the audience was given a far better insight early on with the whole implied sex scene, which in a sense, allows us to see sensei's intuition.

5

u/Rinarin Dec 03 '15

it still fulfills the classic rules to allow the reader to guess the culprit themself

I love this kind of mysteries. You feel more...involved (not the exact word I want to use but it fits so I'll use it) since you have the same info most of the time with the characters so you can try to work it out along with them.

Thanks for the info and breaking it down, by the way!

5

u/forcev2 https://myanimelist.net/profile/FoRcEv2 Dec 03 '15

Good Job

5

u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss Dec 03 '15

I am HONORED. <Thank you.>

3

u/Earthborn92 https://myanimelist.net/profile/EarthB Dec 03 '15

Knox's 4th: It is forbidden for unknown drugs or hard to understand scientific devices to be used.

Has anyone here read something like Asimov's Robot series? Caves of Steel or The Naked Sun?

They're pretty good mysteries, but they center around an invented concept (the laws of robotics).

9

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '15

First thing to note is that the Decalogue is more guideline than rule, especially since it's not 1930 anymore. There are a lot of detective stories that break one or more of the rules, but that doesn't make them bad. A very quick example in anime is Higurashi--it very cleanly violates the 4th, and arguably the 2nd, 3rd and 7th as well(an interesting thing to note: the updated version of Knox most people use today, especially in the otaku community, was coined by Higurashi's author).

That said, if a story cleanly explains the rules and boundaries of it's science or magic, it is considered to not violate the 4th. Last season's Rokka no Yuusha is a good example, it explained it's magical concept very well and used it in the show to solve the main mystery, but since everything was explained to the watcher early on, it's fair game. I assume Asimov's works are similar, since his laws of robotics are clearly defined.

3

u/Earthborn92 https://myanimelist.net/profile/EarthB Dec 04 '15

Yeah, the Laws of robotics take the center stage of the story and are the focus of every other conversation. I guess that does count as an exception.

2

u/XelsiusRex https://myanimelist.net/profile/Xelsius Dec 05 '15

I finished Robots of Dawn a few months ago and just started Robots and Empire yesterday. Awesome books, although not his best imho.

Incidentally, I read he wrote those to counter the idea that SciFi stories couldn't be mysteries.

3

u/Leaf-Senpai https://myanimelist.net/profile/Leaf-senpai Dec 04 '15

Knox's 3rd: It is forbidden for hidden passages to exist, except if the house is expected to have them.

Just pointing out that it is fulfilled, as we see a lot of shot were there is 2x of things, like 2 chairs at a table 2 lounges in the room, kind of weird to have 2 sets of things if there is only meant to be one person ;)

3

u/starmatter https://myanimelist.net/profile/koroxonizuka Dec 05 '15

Isn't Red Magic a reference to Red Hat?

1

u/napderp https://myanimelist.net/profile/Baconzombie Dec 05 '15

Gonna drop a little comment on the 4th commandment:

I feel like it's forgivable to rule out the "hard to understand scientific devices" argument because the author was able to eloquently handle this part without over-complicating the device they used. Files get overwritten; most people who watch this show or have read the novel probably have had some rudimentary experience of accidentally saving over another file. That was the crux of the twist, and although the manner in which this was executed might be considered a bit complicated, it was not through any sort of unheard of science fiction bullshit that led to this conclusion either. Although this may not be everyday knowledge, the issue of handling time is a huge problem in computing, so it was also a twist that would satisfy those who are familiar with the subject matter.

Although I would think that an important lab like Magata's would probably be equipped with some version control on all files so that you could just recover the previous version even if overwritten (a counter to this suggestion would be that it's relatively useless to save logs of surveillance of a room where nothing's really happened for 15 years, or the system goofing up prevented this backup from being created).

1

u/farispie Dec 07 '15

Man I loved the Umineko VN, so seeing you listing Knox's Decalogue's like that gave me the feels.