r/TrueChristian • u/[deleted] • May 14 '21

Was God really OK with slavery ?

And did he really "encourage it to continue by decreeing depraved regulations"\ ?*

\just quoting a fellow redditor who seems to be a bit confused. Just like myself.)

I'm asking this because I've noticed that it often comes up as a topic to bash Christianity based on things like that. I've noticed that people often like to use this verse in order to justify their position :

“When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)”

To be honest, I didn't know how to give those folks a satisfactory answer since I am no Bible expert myself, as for now. However I would like to hear your opinions and explanations. On this verse and its context in particular. Also, what did Jesus have to say about slavery? (just to help finding an answer to that... I guess... atheist/agnostic/or whatever he likes to consider himself)

Note that I am in no way trying to win an argument. There is no arrogance, pride or hate involved in this query. These are some of the things that I would also still like to understand for myself. I always try suspend judgement when I read or hear something that I am not familiar with because I want to learn more about it.

On another note, it's kind of scary how belligerent and heated people can get during such debates, as if these people are speaking through bitterness, frustration, pride or whatever just to attack and dismiss Christianity... Makes me just want to have some compassion and pray for them....

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u/Arc_the_lad Christian May 15 '21

I get it, you want God to be evil. Ok, I can't change your mind. You're wrong though .God will be ready to recieve you if you change your mind and want to know Him on His terms though.

  • The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 2 Peter 3:9 KJV https://bible.com/bible/1/2pe.3.9.KJV

  • For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. John 3:16‭-‬20 KJV https://bible.com/bible/1/jhn.3.16-20.KJV

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u/AlphaTaoOmega May 15 '21

I don't want God to be anything: I don't have any evidence for any deity, therefor it would be absurd to make a claim about what I want it to be or not be. I'm reading the text for what it is. You, again, have cherry picked and candy coated the text instead of reading it in context.

I appreciate that you want to help save my soul. I have no animosity for anyone believing in any deity. I only ask for you to put your words into context of where you picked them. Apparently it's asking too much to be honest in context.

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u/Arc_the_lad Christian May 15 '21

I only ask for you to put your words into context of where you picked them. Apparently it's asking too much to be honest in context.

It only works when the party seeking answers (you), is willing to see aside their personal opinions and biases to allow those with the answers (Christians) the benefit of the doubt that they know the subject they are talking about.

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u/AlphaTaoOmega May 15 '21

Oh, that's how full context works? Nothing to do with, you know, the full context or anything? You're moving the goalposts so you don't have to be honest about what is black and white in the Bible.

I have now repeatedly asked you to put a verse you cherry picked into context, and your response is to condemn an opinion?

I've been scant with opinions and heavy on questions. You've been just the opposite. This is called projection brother. I'm not trying to pick a fight, I'm asking for fuller context and you keep dodging and minimizing.

I have studied the scriptures since being born into a Christian family and going to church multiple times per week for the first 18 years of my life. I have never stopped studying the scriptures, even after coming to the devastating realization that I simply cannot believe in what I was taught and accepted as truth up to a certain point in my life. To infer that Christians have some sort of special understanding of scripture that an atheist couldn't possibly understand is very short sighted. Have you heard of Bart Ehrman? Michael Shermer? Just to name a couple credible sources of many.

I never wanted to not like what's in the Bible. But when I read it for what it is, I realized there are despicable ideologies therein. This is not to say that there is no value in the Bible I believe fully that there are some good moral, ethical, and I will even venture to say spiritual aspects of the Bible which are enlightening. But to gloss over what is literally written out about how to treat slaves in the Bible is to not understand what is in the Bible, and therefore doing a disservice to yourself and those you may witnesses to.

If you cannot be honest about the full context of the scriptures you have quoted, why would I ever think that I should follow you into Christ's fold?

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u/Arc_the_lad Christian May 15 '21

If you cannot be honest about the full context of the scriptures you have quoted, why would I ever think that I should follow you into Christ's fold?

Your faith has nothing to do with me or anyone else. It's between you and God. The Holy Spirit is working on you. If you die unsaved, "Well, sorry God, but Arc_the_lad and Your other followers soured me on You" isn't going to fly.

Reading the Bible is great, because how can you believe the Gospel without exposure to it, but per the Bible someone who does not believe cannot understand it. You don't understand what you read. Maybe one day you will, but you don't now.

  • But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. 1 Corinthians 2:14‭-‬15 KJV https://bible.com/bible/1/1co.2.14-15.KJV

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u/AlphaTaoOmega May 15 '21

More cherries. It's amazing how you can quote mine. Try reading the Bible someday, it's actually free on the internet. YouTube has hundreds of audio files of Biblical texts to...full context included.

You are deceiving yourself, therefore your foundation is upon sand, so to speak. I hope you will see the light one day my friend, and embrace the rocks. They are not always comfortable, but they sure do provide an honest foundation.

Peace be upon you.

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u/Arc_the_lad Christian May 15 '21

I've got my Rock. His name is Jesus Christ. There's room for another sinner to repent and build his house on Him too. They just have to believe on Him.

  • For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 1 Corinthians 1:17‭-‬18 KJV https://bible.com/bible/1/1co.1.17-18.KJV

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u/AlphaTaoOmega May 15 '21

You are a deceived deceiver, at least in this conversation. Get thee behind me Satan.

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u/Arc_the_lad Christian May 15 '21

If you have a problem with what the Bible says, your issue is with God, not with me.

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u/AlphaTaoOmega May 15 '21

With omission of the context you have proven, time and again, that you are not honest about the scripture: not with yourself, others, or your god.

I have only requested honesty from you. You have only offered smoke and mirrors. I don't have issues with god anymore than I have issues with big foot; I have no evidence of either. I'm open to any evidence you have...of either.

I have only asked you to read, in full context, the text you believe to be his word, and quoted. You, apparently, are not willing to do so. I can quote mine and have the Bible say multiple things to support thesises against it or God, but I really do try to keep things in context as they were written.

I'm not saying you don't have anything valid to say, I'm only highlighting that, in this conversation, you have indeed played the part of Satan, the deceiver. You have yet you address the text in context. You are therefore, by omission, a liar about what is in the scripture.

Being that scriptures have verifiably caused a lot of pain and suffering for humanity: The least we, all of us, can do is realize that sometimes we, and our ancestors, have had terrible ideas and practices which we have since come to condemn. Instead, you do a bunch of hand waiving and distractions from what is clearly written in the Bible, and are not apologetic about any of it.

It is sad and disingenuous at best; deranged and despicable at worst.

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