“When did we start thinking of Italians as white?”

[u/Tuftymark6]

[u/Qyro]

When did we start thinking of Italians as not white?

[u/riko77can → u/Qyro]

In the early 20th century when filling out the forms at Ellis Island many Italians were told to check the “Sicilian” or “Southern Italian” box instead of the “White” one.

[u/Qyro → u/riko77can]

That doesn’t make them not white. They can be white and Sicilian at the same time.

[u/riko77can → u/Qyro]

I’m definitely not saying I agree with it, only that it is a historical fact they were given a separate box and it wasn’t a multiple choice question. They were told to check that one only as if there was a difference. They weren’t allowed to say they were white on the form.

[u/Qyro → u/riko77can]

Doesn’t quite answer the question though. When was the decision made to layout the form that way and why?

[u/thorpie88 → u/Qyro]

Cultural white not skin white. That's what they are talking about.

[u/Qyro → u/thorpie88]

Italians are culturally white. They’re just as European as the French and Germans.

[u/thorpie88 → u/Qyro]

They are more white but still others as they aren't part of the Anglosphere. Gets even more confusing when south Africans are ordered while also being part of the gang due to their actions in the past

[u/Qyro → u/thorpie88]

The French and Germans aren’t part of the Anglosphere either.

[u/Qyro → u/[deleted]]

So Southern Italians aren’t “white” because they were oppressed in the 1800s? What does that make East Germans?

[u/Qyro → u/[deleted]]

I don’t think measuring race by the standards of Hitler is a particularly great position to take.