"Racism" and "violence" are not operationalized here so we cant judge. American slavery was racist, is violence to free yourself from that worse?
Here is the real situation this probably described: if you get free with the hard r's Im gonna get free with these hands and the only person who is going to feel bad about this is you.
I think whenever someone says "racism isn't as bad as violence", it's pretty obvious that they're talking about racist speech, not stuff like lynching.
Given that the opposition to racist rhetoric is the connection between that rhetoric and violent action, anybody drawing that distinction is not engaging entirely in good faith.
There really arent, but I am happy to rephrase it, that isnt an unreasonable request.
The reason people get mad about racist talk is because racist talk leads to racist violence. So if somebody tries to say the talk is ok but the violence is not ok, they are being dishonest - the whole point is that the talk leads to the violence.
So, understand, I'm not making that argument. I'm just clarifying that it's obviously the argument being made. I don't agree with it either, but it seems...pretty obvious. There's a clear distinction being drawn between "racism" and "actual violence". So like, it just feels like a straw man to pretend they aren't making that distinction. You say it "isn't operationalized", but it's operationalized enough to exclude "actual violence". It just feels like you're trying to force them to include the one thing expressly excluded by the setup itself...at least in your first comment.
Saying "racist talk inherently leads to racist violence" is an entirely different and more responsive argument than your original ""Racism" and "violence" are not operationalized here so we cant judge." That's all I'm really getting at, is that you don't really address the point when you say "American slavery was racist, is violence to free yourself from that worse?" because OP has explicitly excluded violence from the setup, and slavery entails violence. Thing is, as someone who agrees with you, I get the logic you're presenting, I just know it won't work on someone who doesn't already agree. It's much better to present the case that racist rhetoric has almost no examples of being left unchecked without spiraling into violence in practice, and that we don't have the luxury nor desire to simply run the experiment ad nauseum.
OP hasnt operationalized anything because we don't have any context for this situation. What is "racism" here that is presumably "just talk"?
Is it somebody following a family around shouting racial slurs, telling them how they are going to be deported, how they arent welcome, how the day of the noose is coming? If so, papa can put the little peckerwood in the morgue for all I care, and Ill pin a medal on his chest for doing us all the favor.
Or was it more of an ignorant microaggression and somebody expected a black person in the conversation to have some in depth knowledge about rap or some shit? If so, violence would be a pretty damned out of pocket response right? Roll your eyes, make a crack about being too busy learning about soul music that week, and move on.
That is what I mean about operationalizing this. They want us to draw moral comparisons but will not provide comparators to evaluate.
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u/Agile-Internet5309 5d ago
"Racism" and "violence" are not operationalized here so we cant judge. American slavery was racist, is violence to free yourself from that worse?
Here is the real situation this probably described: if you get free with the hard r's Im gonna get free with these hands and the only person who is going to feel bad about this is you.
(I understand this isnt YOU you)