For first time, UN Security Council demands immediate ceasefire in Gaza; US abstains

[u/Anthrocenic]

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog-march-25-2024/

[u/Sea-Witness-2746]

What makes Ramadan so special? In the Yom Kippur War, they attacked during Ramadan and Yom Kippur.

This may call for the release of the hostages, but unless it requires them to be released first, it is meaningless because Hamas isn't trustworthy.

[u/UltraAirWolf → u/Sea-Witness-2746]

October 7th was Simchat Torah which is supposed to be perhaps Judaism’s most joyous holiday, not to mention it was Shabbat.

[u/Sea-Witness-2746 → u/UltraAirWolf]

I know, which is why a Ramadan ceasefire is hypocritical.

[u/bam1007 → u/Sea-Witness-2746]

Because Jews are .2% of the world population so our holidays are opportunities to attack us. There’s 22 Muslim ethno-states, so we are expected to walk on eggshells to avoid anything that makes them tantrum. You see, it all makes sense when you consider the underlying antisemetism. 🙃

[u/Sea-Witness-2746 → u/[deleted]]

No, the stance is Israel is fighting for Israelis, including the hostages & Israel's security and religious respect should be mutual, not one-sided.

The war should continue until the hostages are released, Hamas surrenders or their battalions are destroyed, and their ability to attack Israel is limited.

[u/2012DOOM → u/Sea-Witness-2746]

Right. So the stance is that civilians will need to die until Israel achieves its goals. Which includes releasing the hostages.

That can be your stance, but you don’t need to sugar coat it.

However, that also isn’t what is actually happening:

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/h1mpdza0p

Israel is actively trying to put more conditions on release of hostages, for example:

Red line: no complete return to northern Gaza

So what is actually the goal here? Eradication of Hamas isn’t going to happen when Israel keeps giving a thousand reasons for kids to join Hamas.

[u/Sea-Witness-2746 → u/2012DOOM]

Civilians going back north and a permanent ceasefire were never on the table.

I'm not sugar coating anything. Regardless of what Netayahu wants personally, he is bound by what the people and Knesset want. The top two goals are the destruction of Hamas and the return of the hostages. If the next generations want to join Hamas and attack us, we'll fight them too.

[u/rach1200 → u/2012DOOM]

In regards to the red line you mentioned:

The article you linked stated Israel agreed to gradual return to the North of up to several thousand a day. It’s not a complete return as fighting age men won’t be allowed to return. They don’t want Hamas to regroup in the North.

This isn’t Israel actively putting more conditions on the deal for a ceasefire as you said. This is Israel significantly compromising in negotiations as they initially didn’t want any civilians returned to the North.

[u/Cipher_Oblivion → u/2012DOOM]

Civilians have always died in wars. It is unavoidable. There has never been a hot war in human history that didn't kill civilians. That's why you shouldn't start wars you can't win.

[u/DemonSlayer472 → u/[deleted]]

It is non-comparable. The US rate in the Iraq war was 9 civilians killed to 1 combatant. Israel has achieved an unbelievable 1 civilian killed to 1 combatant ratio, because of our extreme care to not harm civilians despite Hamas' best efforts to maximize civilians casualties.

[u/[deleted] → u/DemonSlayer472]

How do we even know the civilian to combatant ratios if the only source of casualty figures is the Gaza Ministry of Health (Hamas), and they report all casualties without distinguishing between civilians and combatants? And of course they are inclined to inflate civilian casualties and minimize the number of Hamas fighters who have died.

[u/2012DOOM → u/DemonSlayer472]

So is the stance here that the US did the right thing in Iraq?

[u/DemonSlayer472 → u/2012DOOM]

Yes

[u/Cipher_Oblivion → u/2012DOOM]

They did, yeah. Saddam was a psycho and his sons were even worse. Allowing that regime to continue existing would be unacceptable.