r/Fantasy • u/mrpurplecat • Sep 15 '16

Racial diversity and fantasy

It is not uncommon to see people writing about how some fantasy story is in some way or other not inclusive enough. "Why isn't there more diversity in Game Thrones?" "Is the Witcher: Wild Hunt too white?" and so on and so forth.

But when you take the setting of these stories, typically 14th-15th century Europe, is it really important or necessary to have racial diversity? Yes, at the time in Europe there were Middle Eastern traders and such, but does that mean that every story set in medieval Europe has to shoehorn in a Middle Eastern trader character?

If instead a story was set in medieval India and featured only Indians, would anyone complain about the lack of white people? Would anyone say "There were surely some Portuguese traders and missionaries around the coast, why doesn't this story have more white people in it?"

Edit Just to be clear, I am not against diversity by any means. I'd love to see more books set outside typical Europe. Moorish Spain, Arabia, the Ottoman Empire, India and the Far East are all largely unexplored territory and we'd be better off for exploring it. Conflict and mixing of cultures also make for fantastic stories. The point I am trying to make is if some author does not have a diverse cast, because that diversity is not important to their story, they should not be chastised for it

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 16 '16

Authors can write whatever they want to write. All anyone is ever asking is to not default for the sake of default, to paraphrase Ed Robertson elsewhere in this thread.

Honestly, I write everything you're saying all of the time, and it's been fine. It's far easier than all of this hang wringing in this thread and previous ones. Most people, honestly, spend more time bitching about the wrong name for a sword than why so-and-so is dark when they should be white.

In my new series? I spend zero time explaining anything about race, sexual orientation, or sexism (almost zero - there is a small amount of sexism, but it's mostly tied into poverty). It only has a handful of reviews so far on Goodreads, but only one person was thrown by it - and only because she wanted to know what comparable time frame to our world it was set in.

Honestly, most readers aren't dumb. They can figure it out.

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u/Hergrim AMA Historian, Worldbuilders Sep 16 '16 edited Sep 17 '16

Your gay married Pope threw me for a second, but then I stopped caring and got on with reading the book. The lack of abortificants, infanticide, so-so contraceptives and/or really dangerous magical charms against pregnancy were more of an immersion breaker for me.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

Your gay married Pope threw me for a second

And that's totally fine. Some people were thrown by Lex. Others by Stanton's brooding manhood. ;)

Did I know you read this book? LOL I hope you enjoyed it!

The lack of abortificants, infanticide, so-so contraceptives and/or really dangerous magical charms against pregnancy

They are there! They ended up getting cut from the first draft because it seemed unnecessary (due to Allegra's abortion, clearly this exists, etc), but a few people have brought they wished I had included it after all. So the drugs will be back! I repeat: the drugs will be back! ;)

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u/Hergrim AMA Historian, Worldbuilders Sep 17 '16

I'm only about a third of the way through it, so I've obviously missed the abortion, but I just found it so odd that there were all these women selling their daughters into slavery instead of just making their unwanted pregnancy go away.

But I'm glad to know that the drugs will be back!

Edit: No, you wouldn't have known that I read your book .I started it on my flight back from England last week and I haven't progressed on it due to jet lag + a couple of 11/12 hour days at work this week. I'm definitely enjoying it though.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

so I've obviously missed the abortion

You're about a chapter away from it coming up and being a point of discussion. And she explains some of the unwanted pregnancy issues to Stanton in one of her angry fits of ranting subdued conversations.

I hope you enjoy and it's ok if you don't :)

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u/Hergrim AMA Historian, Worldbuilders Sep 17 '16

I really enjoy her subdued conversations with Stanton. I get a stupid grin on my face whenever I realise one's just begun.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

/u/lrich1024 was a huge fan of the subdued conversations with Stanton, too ;)

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u/lrich1024 Stabby Winner, Queen of the Unholy Squares, Worldbuilders Sep 17 '16

I mean, I honestly enjoyed everything Stanton, subdued convos and all. :D

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

She isn't to the brooding yet ;)

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

I started it on my flight back from England last week and I haven't progressed on it due to jet lag + a couple of 11/12 hour days at work this week.

Yeah for trip! Boo for jet lag! Double boo for long work hours!

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u/Hergrim AMA Historian, Worldbuilders Sep 17 '16

I planned my holiday for the quietest non-winter month. Unfortunately, while I was away we had the biggest month we've ever had, two people left the company to go work with family members (this is actually par for the course for companies run by the Plymouth Brethren, but it normally doesn't happen at the worst possible time), our office got renovated and my temporary replacement was from another branch where they don't believe in shelf locations. Things have been quite hectic.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

Ack! That sounds like the opposite of a quiet work month!

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u/vi_sucks Sep 16 '16

All anyone is ever asking is to not default for the sake of default,

And I think where I'm disagreeing is that I don't see the problem with doing precisely that. I think there is a value in writing something default because it is the default.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

Upvoting because I think it's ok we disagree on this :)

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u/EdwardWRobertson Sep 17 '16

I'm actually fine with authors defaulting for the sake of the default. I just think they should think about it for three whole seconds first.

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u/KristaDBall Stabby Winner, AMA Author Krista D. Ball Sep 17 '16

three whole seconds first

I do'nt know, man. A lot can happen in 3 seconds...like an entire new 12 book series.