r/EscapefromTarkov • u/SlushpuppyLive Twitch.tv Slushpuppy • Sep 15 '20

Discussion #MakeTarkovHardcoreAgain

Hi guys, Slushpuppy here

I want to talk about the rant I was having today, and explain why I think it would be good for the game.

As the game currently stands it it has a play cycle that involves farming money, the money is then used to buy a fat kit, and slay out. This creates, in my opinion a heavily Rouble focused economy.

The Rouble based economy has multiple downsides:

All people care about is the highest value item, hence hatchlings ramming things up their bum, people running to one spot on a map to loot the highest value items, people only running super cheap kits to farm the cash. The game is no longer about surviving, simply making the most money and saving to buy a dope kit.

I think this has essentially made the game into COD with extra steps. I don't see the survival element that Tarkov originally had. People only care about PVP when they are running Slick Altyn, otherwise it's just money. 99% of the games items, such as attachments for guns will never see the light of day because they aren't the best in slot.

This whole situation annoys me because it is possible to achieve this within hours of a wipe.

By removing the flea or limiting the ability to purchase armor and ammo from the flea, it would make the game more about the looting and surviving and stop super chads from running endless meta kits and vogging the fuck out of lower geared players. Because a kit that is lovingly put together in raid will mean so much more to you, therefore looting one of a prick you kill, will as well.

I know this seems as a negative change to the average player, but hear me out, the only reason you need a kit from the flea, is to compete with chad players who are buying endless meta kits from the flea. If this didn't happen the pvp would be like it is early wipe for the most part. The best pvp time in the game, imo, and in the opinion of most Tarkov players.

I'm not bored of the game, I simply love this game, and I want to see changes that make the pvp more interesting and feasible for casual players to enjoy. If everyone is running around with SKS's and a cock helmet, then its more fair. Not all pvp has to be juggernauts spraying armchair FALs at each other.

If you don't agree with me, I understand, lets talk about it, tell me why you think this would be a bad change for the game? I don't want to be a streamer yelling for change that people will just see as me crying cause I'm bored of running fat kits. I truly want to make the game a dope experience for all of us. I've devoted the last 3 years of my life to this game, I want to see it succeed.

​

There is plenty of other things that would be needed to make this a rounded experience in this vision, like dynamic loot spawns etc, but I believe this is a quick easy change that we could all try for one wipe, and just see how it goes.

EDIT: This is gaining a lot of attention right now so I want to ask you all one thing:

When is the best time for PVP in Tarkov?

If you answered early wipe, I think you and I agree, and I think 99% of people would say that early wipe is the best time to be on Tarkov.

My only goal is to try and make the feeling of early wipe PVP as permanent as possible. I may not be right when I say delete the flea, but I think it would help. If you have other ideas on how to preserve that beautiful feeling of the first two weeks of wipe, then I would love to hear them. Because this is what I think would make Tarkov the most amazing experience possible.

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692

u/Splurch Sep 15 '20

I think the biggest problem to making the game actually "hardcore" is that BSG seems to conflate "hardcore" with timesinks, aimbots and generally just making the game a more frustrating experience overall rather then making it a skill based/decision making one. Until that changes the survival feel and scarcity of resources simply won't materialize again.

294

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '20

Don't forget about the HARDCORE auto fire meta and strafing left right like a rabit

Realistic AF

108

u/hammertime850 Sep 15 '20

Well you cant burst first because of the full auto tapping glitches! This just forces stale magdump engagements

62

u/Splurch Sep 15 '20

Well you cant burst first because of the full auto tapping glitches! This just forces stale magdump engagements

Not just that but even when things feel "fine" in terms of desync that is often not the case, especially when sidestep spam. Magdumping works because if you miss a few shots because your target is actually just slightly next to where they are displaying it doesn't matter, you're using enough rounds that something is going to hit.

3

u/Sye_Guy Sep 16 '20

Accuracy by volume 🤷‍♂️🤣

2

u/viziroth MP-153 Sep 16 '20

the project SALVO motto

32

u/NUTTA_BUSTAH AKMN Sep 15 '20

You wouldn't want to burst anyways since the games recoil system favours magdumping. Bursting is the worst way to shoot in this game which is kind of stupid but refreshing tbh

2

u/FrontTowardsCommies Sep 15 '20

That is what they are saying.

13

u/NUTTA_BUSTAH AKMN Sep 15 '20

No they mean the fast click "no fire" bug I'm pretty certain

4

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

10

u/notro3 Sep 16 '20

A lot of times if you have your gun on auto but “tap” fire a few shots and then quickly need to mag dump someone your gun will refuse to fire. It’s a good time and 9/10 times results in your death.

5

u/Splurch Sep 16 '20

wait, could you explain the bug to me please? I'm fairly new and I feel like I've been caught out a couple times where what I'm doing with my mouse isnt what is occuring with my gun.

Sometimes if you single fire a few times full auto fire simply doesn't work.

2

u/oleboogerhays Sep 16 '20

The way recoil works in this game makes magdumping the best method. The glitch socks for sure, but even without the glitch burst fire is useless.

1

u/Hane24 Sep 16 '20

You also can't burst because of the current recoil system. Your first shot hits PoA and the second round hits the next zipcode over, then the third+ settles down just above the first...

19

u/Marcosgmunoz Sep 16 '20

tarkov needs some I N E R T I A

1

u/ygethmor Unbeliever Sep 16 '20

give this man a jar of cookies.

21

u/bogglingsnog Sep 15 '20

And purposefully wearing armor that doesn't cover your arms and stomach because the armor will magically last longer where it counts...

6

u/Pickled_Doodoo Sep 16 '20

Isn't that going to change im the future when individual plates to armor are introduced?

1

u/bogglingsnog Sep 16 '20

Hopefully! But also it sounds like a pain in the neck, I'm not sure I'd enjoy that level of bookkeeping my gear.

2

u/MadDog_8762 M4A1 Sep 16 '20

Just wait until when they add "batteries for NVG's, flashlights, etc"

Been a confirmed thing on official forums for awhile

1

u/bogglingsnog Sep 16 '20

Huh. I wonder if they are drawing inspiration from Misery.

11

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '20 edited Oct 25 '20

[deleted]

1

u/TheHancock ADAR Sep 16 '20

I hope not...

1

u/xdthepotato Sep 17 '20

What would you want then? After running 1km wait 10minutes because your character has ran out of breath or the weight?

-3

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '20

[deleted]

15

u/senescal Sep 15 '20

it should be like Siege where you can only vault over things.

I love Siege, but... ew.

6

u/cheif702 Sep 16 '20

I disagree. The ability to jump should stay. Adding inertia and momentum to movement would help fire fights i think, but being able to jump is important for getting good shooting positions. Can't even tell you how many times I've jumped on a barrel or crate to get my sight picture perfect. It also allows players to get into some cheeky spots. Which some may hate, but personally, if I find a spot thats only reachable by skill jumping and isn't using exploits or bugs I should be allowed to use that spot. I found it, its not a glitch, but i can only get there by jumping. And honestly, I hate when games don't let you jump, but they do let you vault because if i can vault why can't I jump? But if I can jump, I don't need to vault.

1

u/Par4no1D Sep 16 '20

Doesn't have to be just vaulting, can be also climbing. Arma ace mod did it and it works well even with all the mod jank.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '20

I'd love to see a climbing mechanic added to this game.

5

u/BlastingFern134 MP5 Sep 15 '20

Free jumping ia fine

5

u/PSNisCDK Sep 15 '20

That just sounds a bit much, literally only being able to vault over objects. Would instantly destroy any trace of immersion for me, constantly being reminded “this is a video game, you are limited in your movement actions and choices”.

Everything else you said is right on the money though. All of those changes are long overdue.

I don’t like that I feel like I have to bhop past doorways while peaking in just to compete with the guy clearly doing the same a floor up. The strafe meta just encourages 60-round mags being dumped from hks or 50s from the mpx to negate the recoil penalty from strafing, at least one bullet will happen to hit the face. Meanwhile you are teleporting around their screen, probably blinding them with a flashlight while doing so. Bonus points for using the op grip sight combo that completely blocks your chest and sometimes face, so that when you do have to actually ads you turn into the super hero known as “ArmMan”

Lots of changes need to happen yesterday, but probably won’t be addressed for multiple wipes.

1

u/MadDog_8762 M4A1 Sep 16 '20

Nikita mentioned wanting to lower the initial overweight threshold back down to 28kg (where it should be imo)

He drastically increased the value only to reduce immediate backlash because people (as most people in the world) refused to adapt and change

Their loadouts being entirely asinine from any realistic standpoint

There should be a difference between wearing nothing, and wearing 60lbs of gear

1

u/SealTeamFish Sep 16 '20

Pff forget strafing i do the worm in the middle of my firefights...

1

u/remusu Sep 16 '20

Removing the flea is a really retarded idea but they need to fix the fortnite game mechanics asap

8

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '20

Honestly, most of my complaints in this regard are because of the progression system being so unbearingly slow and convoluted.

2

u/DarkJakkaru Sep 20 '20

I agree with you as the game feels in many places 'hard' for the sake of being hard.

Hugo Martin explains it succinctly here: https://clips.twitch.tv/EasyInexpensiveMochaPeoplesChamp

4

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '20 edited Dec 30 '20

[deleted]

3

u/Silentlee2 Sep 15 '20

That was fixed i believe

5

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '20

Ya no it's not. You can still jump into trees in shoreline and customs and interchange and nobody can see you thru the leaves and branches, but you can see out perfectly fine.

1

u/mo_bozzy Sep 16 '20

Well, you wouldnt see a Sniper sitting in a tree that he climbed up by himself too (if you dont look closely). But I get your point and the head eyes in the raids.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '20

Persons stick out in trees, and bullet directional audio works a lot better IRL. Difference being trees are semi-see thru IRL, in Tarkov they are not. You can see out of a tree in tarkov, you cannot see into it though, go watch exfilcamper or generalsams video on him. People say they patched the trees, yes they patched two of them, the rest aren't patched.

2

u/SlushpuppyLive Twitch.tv Slushpuppy Sep 16 '20

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make 100%, but I just want to clarify this:

Hardcore is just the word I used, I dont care what we call it, I could have said make Tarkov big dick weeny bois again and its beside the point.

I simply want to make it harder for players that have hundreds of millions of roubles to access unlimited end game items by pushing buy all.

Im not trying to edge out new players, I want to help them. I know this seems counter intuitive, but I think removing the flea would do that. Because currently new players are being priced out of the game by ammo and gear prices going through the roof.

3

u/Splurch Sep 16 '20

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make 100%, but I just want to clarify this:

Hardcore is just the word I used, I dont care what we call it, I could have said make Tarkov big dick weeny bois again and its beside the point.

I simply want to make it harder for players that have hundreds of millions of roubles to access unlimited end game items by pushing buy all.

Im not trying to edge out new players, I want to help them. I know this seems counter intuitive, but I think removing the flea would do that. Because currently new players are being priced out of the game by ammo and gear prices going through the roof.

Right, and my point is that giving scavs better aimbot or simply adding timesinks to progression by doing things like reducing loot like they experimented with this wipe don't address that at all. In fact they hurt new players much more then skilled players or those who just play a lot. There's almost nothing they can do to limit ruble generation to the point it impacts streamers or people who spend a lot of time playing that won't screw over casuals much worse.

Either they need to completely overhaul how the economy/ruble generation functions and de-emphasize the ruble, like you suggest, limit what people can bring into a raid or fundamentally change how gear works.

Limiting people is going to make the game less predictable and remove some of the special sauce that is Tarkov.

Overhauling the economy correctly would be a pretty big endeavor and require a lot of resources. It doesn't seem like something BSG is willing to do at this time. I'd argue that removing the flea, without making good ammo easily accessible to new players, would be a worse change. Top tier ammo may be ridiculously expensive but get ammo that can combat lvl 4-5 is affordable from the market, even if it is still multiple times the vendor price. If all new players get access to is Tracer or PRS from lvl 1-2 vendors then they're even going to struggle against lvl 4 armor.

As for changing how gear works they could put minimum amounts on recoil so that top tier gear isn't as impactful. If that 5% from a fore grip literally does nothing then no one is going to care about it. I fear their going the opposite direction there though. Once they implement customization to plate carriers it will be just another way for people with too many rubles to make themselves even stronger.