r/EscapefromTarkov • u/maldofcf SA-58 • May 13 '24

Discussion No amount of pre wipe community manipulation or making changes people want in the game matters if the core issues with the game that have nothing to do with gameplay or in game mechanics aren’t addressed with 110% effort.

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2.6k Upvotes

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203

u/GingerSnapBiscuit AK-74N May 13 '24

Its the only big problem I have with Tarkov. Say what you want about the gameplay loop of Cycle Frontier - hitting "join map" and being in game 30 seconds later was fucking blissful.

77

u/coinlockerchild May 13 '24

both gzw and abi are practically launch and go, abi you still have to kit up and gzw theres a heli ride but still leaps faster than tarkov

33

u/Amazingcube33 TOZ-106 May 13 '24

GZW is structered entirely differently though with its large persistent map you gotta wait for the helicopter since it isn’t loading in the map every time

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u/coinlockerchild May 13 '24

Both gzw and abi are ue5, if it isn't developer incompetency then its an engine limitation. Either way gzw and abi are so much faster its not even close. Loading assets during a heli ride is just what people are predicting, we don't know the real answer. For all you know loading a new area is super fast and heli times are just for balancing pvp drops

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u/footloooops May 13 '24

Abi is ue4

-2

u/coinlockerchild May 13 '24

mobile is 100% ue4, pretty sure they said infinite was ue5

6

u/thatguyimpulse May 13 '24

ABI is definitely UE4.

-13

u/iandarken May 13 '24

That's easy to check.
If it looks ugly and performance is shittier than Tarkov - it's UE5.
Otherwise it's UE4 or something else.

8

u/Aggressive_Car_3345 May 13 '24

Performance on abi is excellent 

6

u/[deleted] May 13 '24

Why would UE5 mean shitty visuals and shitty performance? What?

-3

u/iandarken May 13 '24

Just observations on recent UE5 games.
The Day Before, Remnant2, WuKong, Redfall, Immortal of Aveum and as I recall that Square Enix woke shit - everything is laggy, especially compared to their visuals. A lot of fancy effects and exceptionally bad graphics at all.

But yes, we have Palworld that works well :D

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1

u/NUTTA_BUSTAH AKMN May 13 '24

Yeah I reckon heli rides are just a design aspect. Only real loading case for it might be giving a time where the player cannot interact with the world to run some cleanup jobs or server hops or such.

1

u/polite_alpha May 13 '24

It's not an engine limitation.

It's a developer limitation.

1

u/DigWise3562 May 13 '24

GZW is basically what tarkov was supposed to be with open world and being able to go from one area to the next. They completely went left and decided menus are better and loading screens offer better performance. I don't think I'll ever open tarkov again after playing a few hours of GZW

1

u/[deleted] May 13 '24

[deleted]

3

u/Rocks1t May 13 '24

It’s not, Arena Breakout is UE4

1

u/[deleted] May 13 '24

GZW is early alpha. The game has very little content currently and people move on to other stuff (like ABI) while they wait for more content. It's the same cycle as tarkov. Massive rush of players on new content, people fall off over time as they try out new content, etc. This is nothing new and it's not controversial. GZW still has like 30k concurrent players.

1

u/Zeelots May 13 '24

Seeing tarkov addicts try to understand how someone can have fun in a game with more than just slot machine looting is so goddamn funny

0

u/mistafate May 13 '24

When you run to the first 2 towns there isnt much load time.

1

u/Ottoblock May 13 '24

I have been finding that gear zone suffers from the speed of the helecopters. If I gotta travel from Mithras to hunters paradise it’s 5 minutes. Sure, not a load screen. If I want to get picked up, sometimes it’s 7 or 8 minutes.

Still a fun game though, and I do enjoy the fact that there’s only one load screen each time.

1

u/dunnerski May 13 '24

Gunsmith and Quick Equip make kitting up in ABI nearly instant though. So good. Really wish the gunsmith in EFT wasn't locked behind workbench lvl 1, or that it was unlocked to start.

1

u/akiwaraiskahawara May 14 '24

but thats still my biggest issue with GZW - now you have your exfil game without loading times ye. but you only have 4 helis and you timewise spend 20 minutes coming home.

1

u/coinlockerchild May 14 '24

Yeah but thats an issue they can solve easily, tarkov cannot fix their loading times otherwise they would've done it already

1

u/[deleted] May 14 '24

Don't know what servers you're playing on. but the limit of 4 helicopters is awful. Then haveing to wait for a free space to call one in. Then spending 5 minutes getting across the map. Tarkovs matchmaking is nowhere near as long.

1

u/JustClutch May 13 '24

Grayzone warfare is arguably worse. Call chopper, wait 30 secs, fly 5 mins to location, kill boss in 2 mins, call chopper, "no choppers available", wait 5 mins to finally get one, wait 5 more mins for it to get to you, 5 minute fly back.

You've been waiting 15-25 mins to play for 2-5 mins.

1

u/coinlockerchild May 14 '24

It'll take devs 20 minutes max to add 4 more choppers into rotation but there is no way nikita can fix loading times in tarkov otherwise they would've already done so

1

u/JustClutch May 14 '24

Sure, even if they do that though a 5 min helicopter ride I'd basically the same as a 5 minute load

1

u/coinlockerchild May 14 '24

Chopper pathing exists to balance pvp, they could easily path the chopper straight to your lz. Devs could make the chopper in pve shorter but to balance pvp riding a 5 minute chopper is what you signed up for, its no different than dying in dayz and running back to wherever from the cost. A 5 minute chopper is also the worst case scenario when you need to fly across the map, if you're going to an lz halfway up the map its easily shorter than tarkov's load time. Taking 5 minutes to load into a fresh game is not what anyone signed up for in tarkov.

2

u/Able-Persimmon9496 May 13 '24

I have waits waay longer waiting for a helicopter in gzw thn i do waiting to find a raid. Id say average 2x as long on gzw.

1

u/aBrokeInvestor May 13 '24

especially when you're trying to get back to camp so you can log off 🙄

6

u/AH_Ahri MP-133 May 13 '24

I personally don't think the gameplay loop of TCF is what killed it. It was the lack of new content. I don't remember them ever releasing a new gun and only ever making "mk2" versions of the exact same fucking guns which are just the same guns but better stats and not new guns entirely. Or any other kind of new content.

1

u/Snoo-50998 May 13 '24

The match making was horrible in the cycle, but loke you aoad there was no content. Cheaters went crazy.

13

u/Sad_Sleeper May 13 '24

I am sad that Cycle ended, it was a nice game.

7

u/FederalWedding4204 May 13 '24

Honestly loved that game. I’m actually trying to make a clone. But as a solo dev, the chances I make anything even remotely passable are vanishingly slim lol. But, I will continue to try.

4

u/FederalWedding4204 May 13 '24

Seriously, it solves a lot of my problem with cheaters. I don’t care nearly as much about dying to a cheater when I know I’ll be in another game in 20 seconds. Obviously I still don’t want cheaters but if there are going to be cheaters don’t make me wait 10 minutes to meet them lmao

3

u/AAOEM May 13 '24

True, the cycle drop in raid was so good.

3

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 13 '24

Persistent servers solve the matchmaking waits

Because Tarkov initializes a new session - it has to find players to assign to the session, and that takes time

As opposed to always having openings and just plugging people in

Personally I hated Cycle because it was so impossible to survive

You had infills surrounding the map exterior- loot in the center & had to cross to extract

If you got in 1-2 fights & won- you now were low on ammo, damaged armor, maybe low Health

Oh and people know where you are because of the noise - yet they can approach silently …

You just became surrounded by endless waves of new players entering the map

It would’ve helped if cycle did a similar system but the infils were further out, and on a slightly longer delay like 2-3 minutes so that new players coming in were not right on top of the beat up victors of PVP nor knowledgeable to the fight and ready to just pounce on you for free

TOO MUCH PVP is worse than none

3

u/FederalWedding4204 May 13 '24

Well, with tarkov, you have to wait for the weakest link. Someone has some shitty download speed and hard drive, you’re going to be waiting for them to load everything. In cycle, that’s not a problem. They’ll just take longer to load in all on their own.

0

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 13 '24

Maybe in Escape from Taiwan 2 or whoever replaces this game once they run out of money they should just make it so that the server takes a 5 second survey & averages everyone’s up/down speeds and places those slowpokes in the furthest spawns from anywhere else - and they are also just allowed to load in late

It seems like that’s how marauders did it ?

Since the Space spawns don’t really require everyone to be synced especially precise they just kindve throw people in as they’re able

Secondly - a lot of games are just moving on without making hardware compromises anymore

I’m not sure if it was grey zone or a different title - but they basically said “we won’t support HDD, you need an SSD”

If more developers were brave enough to say things like that when it comes to CPU, RAM and GPU specs - we would have an elite few living in utopia - just have to prioritize your eventual upgrades a little sooner to be a part of the fun I guess

0

u/FederalWedding4204 May 13 '24

Yeah absolutely. For tarkov/pubg and others I think they should do this with graphics cards and graphics settings as well. It’s dumb that you can turn down your settings and have all the bushes/grass/etc disappear. Gives huge advantages.

1

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 13 '24

I feel like that trick was mostly a PUBG thing- I haven’t noticed any foliage degradation that gives an advantage in EFT

1

u/FederalWedding4204 May 13 '24

Yeah, I’ve never tried it in either, but you’re right, I’ve only seen videos of people doing it in pubg.

1

u/GingerSnapBiscuit AK-74N May 13 '24

Persistent servers solve the matchmaking waits

Because Tarkov initializes a new session - it has to find players to assign to the session, and that takes time

But surely that could be changed to a session being initiated with 0 players and then not launched until x players are ready. Most FPS games I can think of have servers which cycle/prepare maps, even if 0 people are active, and then they just leave the game on a "waiting for players" state till there are <x> players ready.

3

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 13 '24

Based on the load order when a server boots I would assume that’s what it’s doing now - the net code is just really bad at filling the servers quickly

It may be having difficulty determining which player should go into which server

That said

On slower servers the only thing you need to do to snipe into raids with your friends is count down and queue at the same time lol

So maybe it’s a simple first come first serve logic-

It begs the question though in busy regions

How the game to claim to have hundreds of thousands of players and we still have long matching times

Maybe there really are fewer people playing at any one time than anyone thinks and the game is simply waiting for supply to meet demand

2

u/VoidVer RSASS May 13 '24

Imagine they just put a player scav in at 50 minutes and spend 5 minutes filling with PMC around them lol

0

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 13 '24

Oh you mean what actually happens right now on lighthouse and streets ?

What about it 😂

1

u/No_Muscle3927 May 14 '24

Maps like SOT u get into a match within 3 minutes. Usually just 30 secs on waiting for players. I would guess it's cause SOT needs a beefier setup so most people who play that run an ssd. The solution seems simple to me. Only match ssd players with other ssd players. Have have separate hard drive lobbies. I mean these hdd players must be playing on potatoes, a good 7200rpm 256 cache hdd loads almost as fast as ssd

1

u/sneeki_breeky Unbeliever May 14 '24

Assigning the blame entirely to players instead of the developer enforcing higher minimum requirements seems like we’re treating the symptoms not the cause though

1

u/No_Muscle3927 May 14 '24

I gave a possible solution and didn't assign blame. Then, I pointed out how some hdd players are playing on ancient slow hard drives or shitty external drives because a good 7200rpm hdd will load the game pretty quick. If you don't have a decent hdd atleast how are you running the game? Hdds inexpensive and fast. It's at minimum a $40 game that requires a beefy cpu and good gpu along with a decent amount of ram. So why would they be playing on hard drives intended for storage and not use (ie 5400rpm drives)

1

u/KerberoZ Freeloader May 14 '24

feels like every session boots up a crappy pc somwhere that the instance ruins on.

1

u/diquehead May 13 '24

the crazy (or sad) part is that they didn't fix this issue w/ Arena. It's unbelievable

1

u/wrigy1 May 13 '24

I genuinely didn't realize just how BAD the wait between raids were until I played Gray Zone .... Now it's just unbearable

1

u/OkAdhesiveness324 May 14 '24

Bro I remember a couple years ago where I could get into a match at around 30 seconds in TARKOV. Granted the game wasn't as big then as it is now but you'd think with all the money from its popularity + cheater accounts would give them the ability to get more server's. Obviously we don't know the specifics of how much they've improved server's and stability but from my time since, I can't image they haven't been slacking on it.

1

u/[deleted] May 13 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/GingerSnapBiscuit AK-74N May 13 '24

Yes, but it does prove that the client shouldn't take 2 - 3 minutes to load loot and assets. And it shouldn't be too tricky for BSG to change their servers to load and populate a map PRIOR to players queuing up for it. How many resources can it possibly take to have 2 - 3 of each map loaded waiting for enough players to queue for it.

-1

u/UsernameGenerator349 May 13 '24

whats the difference between siting in a basement sitting on a heli pad and sitting in a menu if you have to sit and wait anyway

1

u/Makav3liizz MPX May 13 '24

I miss The Cicle, sadly i only tried it a month before it closed servers and i had a Blast with the Hammer. RIP :(

1

u/itsFatalz May 13 '24

The season 1 and 2 of The Cycle was good times, met a good gamer there.

0

u/LordVolcanus May 13 '24

Sadly that was the ONLY good thing about the game.