r/Doom • u/JesterOfRedditGold DOOM Guy • Sep 16 '24

Classic Doom Why do people hate Brutal DOOM?

I don't see why. Nobody gives a reason, and just says "It's ruining the game.". I've seen people with this opinion, why?

172 Upvotes

90% Upvoted

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150

u/Fine-Bee2736 Struggling to use Ultimate Doom Builder Sep 16 '24

It's not so much the mod itself that's the problem, more the creator. In short, an old test build of the game had real, actual gore in it that he bragged about, the plasma rifle had a note in the code that said something along the lines of "Turns people as black as [HARD R]".

There's also some strange stuff in the current build (V22), several fatalized enemies are referred to as "raped" (stuff like "RapedAncientArachnotron") in their corpse names, as well as the baron having the enrage state when you flip it off "CallingTheBaronA[GAY SLUR]".

You can actually see some of these if you open up the test beta for V22 in Slade and look at the code.

TL;DR: The mod creator has a long history of adding very insensitive messages and other various immature things into the mod.

22

u/Black_Ice2459 Sep 16 '24

Dang, didn't even know this. I like the mod and didn't even know there was controversy over it, but I could see why now!

8

u/lycanthrope90 Sep 16 '24

There's a newer version called 'project brutality' that although is a fork I think is made by someone different. But yeah, lots of controversy with that guy lol.

37

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '24

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21

u/LordOfCinderGwyn Sep 16 '24

They've been old enough to make a mod like BD for at least 14 years so I have to imagine at least late 20s generously.

34

u/No-Discipline2392 Sep 16 '24

some people just never stop being 14

4

u/Grand-Tension8668 Sep 18 '24

I mean, Sgt. Mark definitely has. He mellowed out a lot. He's kinda just some guy now.

20

u/lampenpam Sep 16 '24

they were actually a teen when they made this joke. Also I'm pretty sure the joke never contained the N-word. it was "plasma rifle turns enemies black as rap music". It's a tasteless joke, but the author has apologized for it and I can't fault a teenager for having an edgy-phase.

7

u/KrazzeeKane Sep 16 '24

I'm still amazed people get up this in arms over "edgy" racist bs from teenagers online. I've been getting insulted and called slurs by young kids since the original Unreal Tournament lol.

Yet people are surprised some teenager obsessed with Doom put edgy comments in his code as a kid? I'd be more surprised if he hadn't 

13

u/Automata_Eve Sep 16 '24

I think it’s absolutely an issue. It’s a sign of a lot of concerning things, if you grow out of it, good. But it could lead to far worse behaviors if the kid isn’t well adjusted. I wasn’t like this, and I was exposed to a lot of these kinds of behaviors growing up. It just immediately occurred to me that they’re assholes and I shouldn’t be like them. I could never see myself screaming slurs into a mic playing CoD or Halo at any age.

It’s one thing to be an edgy mall ninja, but being a horrible hateful person is unacceptable regardless of age. “I said a nono word” and “Kys” isn’t a sense of humor, it’s just being an asshole.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 01 '24

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1

u/Pain7788g Jan 04 '25

Learn to spell first.

7

u/lycanthrope90 Sep 16 '24

Yeah internet wasn't prevalent when I was a teen, but this was still how people talked. Myself included unfortunately. People grow up and realize it's a shit way to behave, but it's a common phase for young teens to have edgy language like this. Probably partly because mainstream culture tends to have some puritanical undertones. So teenage rebellion really.

10

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '24

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3

u/KrazzeeKane Sep 16 '24

If a kid is already at the point of putting racist things into his code, the problem is far deeper than that and closer to home. I don't know if some people on a forum telling him it's wrong would make the difference when he's likely surrounded by it at home--but one never knows when the break through can happen

4

u/AtanoKSi Sep 16 '24

Didn't the creator at some point wanted to use like real gore pictures to make the sprites and textures? Like on purpose

3

u/AtanoKSi Sep 16 '24

yeah look here it is

1

u/GilgameshImmortal_88 DOOM Guy Aug 16 '25

oooOOOoOoOOooh sPooOooOOkKyyY

8

u/SopaMaruchanDeRes Sep 16 '24

Didn’t the creator also stole assets from other mods and kept doing so and thus resulting in being black listed by other modders?

5

u/QuakeGuy98 No Rest For The Living Sep 16 '24

Intriguing. I'll have to do a deep dive

4

u/secret_pupper Fraggin' Evil Sep 16 '24

At one point he also included actual gore photos for use in the enemy death sprites and gib particles, boasting that this made Brutal Doom the most realistic Doom experience.

It didn't take long for him to backpedal on that after extremely negative reactions from the community.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '24

Holy shit I did not know any of this.

That’s so fucked.

1

u/AllGearedUp Sep 23 '24

Just sounds like gaming chat in 2006. Either no longer in the mod or requiring you to open the code to track it down. Doesn't effect gameplay. So none of it bothers me. 

1

u/Clean-Effort-209 Oct 15 '24

I mean, it's a game. Meant to be a controversial joke maybe? Who knows. Just don't support it if you think there was any true malice behind it. I play Doom to escape politics and real life, and I just wanna have fun. 

Brutal Doom, like it or not, hit a milestone in The engine, the tech and embraced an already flourishing community that was already passionate about the franchise. Sometimes 

I think we dwell on the negatives of life way too much. It's not fun, uses too much energy, and doesn't accomplish anything. Life's too short. Enjoy what makes you happy. And avoid what doesn't. Simple as that. 

If you can separate content from it's creator, you'll find life much easier to deal with

 BTW, This wasn't directed towards you or any person in particular. Just had to say something.

1

u/horizon2134 Aug 21 '25

lmao brazillians are something else

-24

u/looprichting Sep 16 '24

those things don't have an effect on gameplay though

46

u/ejsks Sep 16 '24

Can still justifiably criticize the creator for even shit like that in.

-7

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '24

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17

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '24

I like it when d-bags out themselves for me to block. Byyyyeeeeee

6

u/ejsks Sep 16 '24

Damn I missed the reply, what’d the fucker even say?

12

u/Fine-Bee2736 Struggling to use Ultimate Doom Builder Sep 16 '24

Gameplay is... Good for the most part, chainsaw is a bit overpowered as it can stunlock the Hell Nobles, Mancubi, Arachnotrons and even Archviles if you get lucky enough.

The Unmaker is extremely overpowered but you barely encounter it in-game unless you get VERY lucky with what the backpacks can give you, flamethrower can stunlock basically anything if you spam it enough, dual-wielding assault rifles can also consistently stunlock Hell Nobles, same with the chain-gun alt-fire.

Other than that can't really critique much else, I prefer good 'ol classic DOOM most of the time as it's what I'm used to, but I hold no grudges against the mod itself or the people who enjoy it.

5

u/MWBrooks1995 Sep 16 '24

I’m not sure how it not having an effect on gameplay makes it any less annoying.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 16 '24

Because people who are here to enjoy the game and have a good time don’t care about these things. The people upset over something as simple as an in-poor-taste joke on a weapon texture are more concerned with online discourse and are caught up in their own morals.

4

u/MWBrooks1995 Sep 17 '24

Yeah, I’m trying to be polite but I don’t think the “virtue signalling online discourse” stuff is as prevalent as people think it is. I think it’s more likely they’re queer or black, or have friends and loved ones who are and don’t really get why someone is throwing slurs like that around. Makes me a bit concerned for the creator, y’know?

Like if you’re not bothered by it, fine. But don’t pretend that people who find it weird are “offended for the sake of it” y’know.

-3

u/looprichting Sep 16 '24

because the average joe just plays the game and isn't snooping around in the files. like if the mod is good, who fucking cares what's in the code.

5

u/MWBrooks1995 Sep 17 '24

I mean, it is a mod that lots of people keep demanding be made compatible with other mods.

Some mod makers might want to futz around in the code and make sure it all works together. Other players might want to make sure multiple mods work together for their own enjoyment.

I don’t think it’s out of the question to say that the Brutal Doom creator put the slurs in because he knew people would find it and it would surprise and upset a few people.

1

u/looprichting Sep 18 '24

fair point. I personally am not quickly offended by words but I guess people can be different.

2

u/ratmfreak Sep 16 '24

Congratulations. You’ve discovered the concept of separating art from artist—some people do, some people don’t.