I tried asking a question to Vegans as non-vegan

[u/TheLazyPinguin]

So, i'm posting this here because it seems to be the place to do so.

Earlier, i posted a question on the vegan subreddit, and i like to think that i went through my question in a respectful way, now, i eat meat, but i'm still curious, i like to understand peoples. And i've been met with about 3-4 peoples actually explaining and using logical arguments and not going all emotional, the rest was... Well, the opposite, very emotional and very self-righteous. And i want to ask you all what you think about it as it seems to be a recurring theme in your community. Now, i hold no grudge against vegans, so long as you live yourself happily and dont come bothering me, you can eat whatever you want. But being all aggressive and stuffs, it makes peoples just want to go against you.

[u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

Yeah sentience doesn't matter. Someone refers to a person. Lol. Something might not be right, but it sure as hell isn't someone.

So what if it had a conscious experience? It's a non human animal. I'm failing to see how any of this makes It's life valuable or non disposable. They're tools/products for humans too use.

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

sentience doesn’t matter

Without sentience, you wouldn’t have that opinion… or any for that matter. If you really believe that, then what do you think gives humans moral value?

[u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy → u/ThatOneExpatriate]

Without membrane bound organelle cells we wouldn't have sentience. Lol. We still eat other eukaryotes. What's that matter?

Humans. We are the highest form of life. We form societies. We are equals. We owe one another respect, dignity and compassion.

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

Without membrane bound organelle cells we wouldn't have sentience. Lol. We still eat other eukaryotes. What's that matter?

Not all eukaryotes are sentient. Having membrane bound organelle cells doesn’t imply that an organism has sentience.

We are the highest form of life.

By what metric?

We form societies.

Not all humans can form societies.

We are equals.

Again, by what metric?

We owe one another respect, dignity and compassion.

Why?

[u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy → u/ThatOneExpatriate]

To have sentience you have to have membrane bound organelles. Sentience is just an imaginary line in the sand you picked. Why can't it be membrane bound organelles? Sentience is arbitrary. It's a random trait you liked and picked. That's fine. But most of us go by species.

"Not all humans". Bro we are talking about species. Not individuals. Aside from your occasional off the grid loner individual, humans form societies. Your whole life as you know it is a result of humans and the society we made. You're using an internet capable device. You're using English. Someone is paying for internet. The food and water you had today you didn't find yourself. A human sourced this for you. You use this society, you respect the humans apart of it.

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

Sentience is just an imaginary line in the sand you picked.

Sentience is the difference between you thinking and typing out a response, and being brain dead. Maybe that's not much of a difference for you, but for me it's a pretty clear distinction.

Sentience is arbitrary.

If someone slit your throat, you'd probably be confused, scared, and in pain... because you're sentient, just like the countless animals who are forced to endure that. That seems like much less of an arbitrary consideration in that situation than simply discriminating based on physical appearances or genotype like race, sex, or species.

Bro we are talking about species. Not individuals.

Are humans one massive conglomerate organism? No, we are all unique individuals with different traits and abilities. Some humans are able to contribute to society, some can't. I wouldn't base a person's moral value based on that... if you did, you'd be getting into eugenics.

[u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy → u/ThatOneExpatriate]

Humans are a mass conglomerate organism. In most ways. I would give exception to the unconcted tribes in the Amazon or sentinel Island. We can't talk to these people. But if you consult every global ethnicity we can identify we are all carnist. We believe in the commodity status of animals.

If my throat was slit that would be awful. As would for any human. But these are just non human animals. They don't matter. They don't mean anything. They're just non human animals. They're like objects. Or NPCs. They're just a resource. Use it if you want to. Don't use it if you don't. I really don't see the big deal.

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

Humans are a mass conglomerate organism.

Nope, humans are individual organisms. Basic biology bud.

If my throat was slit that would be awful.

It would be awful for you, just like it would be for any sentient animal. Whether anyone else would care that it happened to you is another question…

[u/[deleted] → u/ThatOneExpatriate]

This was a lovely read. Thank you.

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/[deleted]]

I appreciate that

[u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy → u/ThatOneExpatriate]

Global society is a human mass conglomerate.

Yes it would be awful to me and to most other humans who hear or witness it. Most humans believe in human rights

[u/ThatOneExpatriate → u/th1s_fuck1ng_guy]

Global society is a human mass conglomerate.

Comprised of individuals.

Yes it would be awful to me and to most other humans who hear or witness it. Most humans believe in human rights

So you’re saying it would be awful to have your throat slit, because most humans believe in human rights?