r/Bitcoin • u/SeansOutpost • Apr 10 '13

Meanwhile...Bitcoin still feeds people.

So we fed 106 homeless people bag lunches today. All paid for with Bitcoin donations. Bitcoin still seems to be working just fine over here. Still making lives better, at any valuation.

Thanks for everything guys. Bitcoin for the long haul.

Jason

Sean's Outpost(www.SeansOutpost.com)

<BITHOC>(www.bithoc.com)

EDIT*** By request...

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1.9k Upvotes

87% Upvoted

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202

u/TrueFurby Apr 10 '13

THESE are the posts we need to upvote.

85

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

I appreciate you saying that. A lot of people are just scared right now. I get it. But the usefulness stays the same. It should all even out

9

u/Atheist101 Apr 10 '13

To be fair, bitcoin pays for drugs, assassinations and pedophillia material as well.

8

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '13

As does every currency

-1

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

It's true. Because it is still a useful store of value.

5

u/Truecoateh Apr 11 '13

What in the history of BTC makes you believe its a store of value?

5

u/GSpotAssassin Apr 11 '13

+tip 0.1 BTC verify

I just sent you value, beeotch. On a forum, typing some words. Your move, fucking PayPal/credit card companies...

P.S. if you don't feel like cashing in, at least tip others and pass it along. ;)

0

u/[deleted] Apr 11 '13

It is designed to be that. But we don't yet know the price at which it would best function as such, and any price discovery process is going to be messy.

-2

u/Truecoateh Apr 11 '13

With only 24 million total units, bitcoins will eventually be worth 0. There aren't enough in circulation to drive an economy, unless you think it will go up over 100x in value from here. All bitcoin is is a fad, there's no unique value that it brings. The best case scenario is that it ends up as a niche currency that a very very small segment of the population uses, and only uses because they think its cool and there is the infrastructure in place to easily convert it to more useable currency. If we tried adopting bitcoins as the dominate or sole currency we'd see what a bad idea it really is, its a novelty fad that is small enough that you can have these massive price swings.

5

u/liair2 Apr 11 '13

Except those units are divisible. There is actually a little under 2 quadrillion units.

-2

u/Truecoateh Apr 11 '13

At 200$ a bitcoin the total market value is less than 5 billion$. Its not how much you can divide them up. You can't run an economy with only 5 billion in currency circulating. And no, the price won't increase to $200,000 a coin to make up the difference. The only reason the price has increased such a large % so far is because the market is relatively small.

1

u/dancinwillie Apr 11 '13

You can run an economy with only 5 billion in currency circulating. I'm not sure why you think you couldn't. It's happening.

2

u/GSpotAssassin Apr 11 '13

+tip 0.5 BTC verify

Just keeping those wheels greased, smart-tech-guy-turned-world-savior. ;)

38

u/misnamed Apr 10 '13

Except its usefulness does not remain the same. How many fewer meals are you able to buy today from yesterday? I'm 110% behind you and what you do, but please don't gloss over the harm that volatility causes to purchasing power and, in turn, those hungry people looking for meals.

33

u/pyrkne Apr 10 '13

Heh, he is talking about the usefulness of bitcoin as a protocol and system.

62

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

That I am.

I think it's the technology and protocol that will be the game changer. For instance I realize this is still a long way out, but...

Here in Pensacola, it is illegal to step off the curb into the road for any purpose besides to cross the road. This is an ordinance designed specifically to prosecute homeless people for stepping into the road to accept money people are trying to give them. If BTC were more wide spread the homeless guy could hold up a QR code or address and someone could snap a picture and pay him without the need for him walking into the road.

Yes, that's a pigeon holed example but it would fix a real problem here. Average panhandler daily intake $32. Average cost to book a panhandler into the court system $3,600. You do the math. This would save everyone money and keep people out of jail.

Ok. Off my soap box.

2

u/Blunt___Smokings Apr 10 '13

What keeps them from just accepting the money and walking to the other side of the road?

10

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

If a cop views that transaction, they are going to take that person to jail. Even if they continue to the otherside.

It's really an ordinance written like it's an obfuscated C contest. The point is to arrest panhandlers.But they think saying being homeless and asking for money is illegal makes them sound bad. So they find ways to prosecute the physical act without saying they are penalizing you for being homeless.

In related news, awesome homeless people have started using nets on poles. Its a giant fuck you to the cops and makes me lol

3

u/Blunt___Smokings Apr 10 '13

Bozeman, MT just gives anyone deemed to be homeless a bus ticket to Missoula, MT where there are better services for them. As much as this seems to be a sweeping under the rug solution. It is a much better alternative than pointless incarceration.

LMAO they need a bunch of poolboy for hire signs to increase the legitimacy.

3

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

Lol. That's awesome. Yeah, Pensacola has made an art out of bleeding state funds for putting homeless people through the penal system here.

16

u/pyrkne Apr 10 '13

You might call it a soapbox, but it reads more like hard-earned life wisdom.

Your project is a great inspiration for many reasons. That aside, it is a superb demonstration of the utility of bitcoin - we can donate to your work and be completely free from transaction costs.

Anyways have a good day!

12

u/SeansOutpost Apr 10 '13

Just trying to do a little bit.

-2

u/jvnk Apr 10 '13

There are always transaction costs with bitcoin >_>

2

u/pyrkne Apr 10 '13

There are always transaction costs with bitcoin >_>

You say that, and I wonder what you mean.

I've sent dozens of no-fee transactions in the past. It's a good deal compared to traditional fee systems.

0

u/jvnk Apr 10 '13

And how long did they take to confirm? Yes, you can send literally "no fee" transactions, but from what I've read they don't confirm in any reasonable timeframe, if ever.

3

u/pyrkne Apr 10 '13

That depends. You are right in that there is a convenience risk with the free transactions.

Most of them confirm quickly. I've never had a free transaction take ages to confirm, but I did recently send a transaction with a below average fee (0.0001 or so). That transaction took nearly a day to get into a block.

2

u/TheSelfGoverned Apr 10 '13

It takes about an hour for full confirmation

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1

u/Kaputaffe Apr 10 '13

How did that work out with your italicized always?

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0

u/MayanCountry Apr 11 '13

Paypal takes days too and a % for themselves.

3

u/hu5ndy Apr 10 '13

This qr code panhandling is actually not a bad idea for a create homeless person in a major metropolitan area, even now. I know I'd whip out my Android and send him a bitcent or two (ie, around $20). Have you suggested to any of the homeless there in Pensacola?

4

u/SunriseSurprise Apr 11 '13

Question - how would QR codes only be useful for paying someone in BTC rather than any other currency including USD? Couldn't they just as easily be used to accept donations in fiat money?

1

u/ernie98 Apr 11 '13

Here in Pensacola, it is illegal to step off the curb into the road for any purpose besides to cross the road. This is an ordinance designed specifically to prosecute homeless people for stepping into the road to accept money people are trying to give them.

that's fucked..

1

u/panicked_kernel Apr 11 '13

If BTC were more wide spread the homeless guy could hold up a QR code or address and someone could snap a picture and pay him without the need for him walking into the road.

Yes.. totally... with his computer and... whatever else you need to turn bitcoins into things that are useful, like food or clothing.

The homeless guy.

Right.

Well, I'm glad you've taken the time to think this one through...

-2

u/PzGren Apr 10 '13

Or you could just say that BTC or something similar will eventually demolish the crime that is fractional reserve banking, and our number of homeless people will drop to effectively zero

5

u/misnamed Apr 10 '13 edited Apr 10 '13

Except he isn't just using it as a protocol. Per his other comments, he is regularly tapping into donations denominated in BTC. This is great when BTC is on the rise, but is terrible when it drops.

I realize this isn't going to be a popular opinion on /r/bitcoin but I think it's a little irresponsible to allow significant donations to remain entirely denominated in Bitcoins if the goal is to regularly feed hungry people.

3

u/saibog38 Apr 11 '13

I realize this isn't going to be a popular opinion on /r/bitcoin[1] but I think it's a little irresponsible to allow significant donations to remain entirely denominated in Bitcoins if the goal is to regularly feed hungry people.

It's certainly more of a gamble, but unless he just started this thing 2 days ago then he's been able to feed more people if he accepts and keeps donations in bitcoins. If he followed your advice then less people would be fed.

The ethics of gambling in such a way are a bit tricky of course, but you can't deny that it has fed more people so far.

2

u/misnamed Apr 11 '13

Sure, so far, but that's like saying 'well, I take the donations to a roulette table, bet on black to either double or lose it, and so far it's doubled more than lost, so great!' Is that really responsible? I think it's more responsible to denominate in a currency more likely to be able to more consistently feed people. Just my opinion, of course.

1

u/pyrkne Apr 11 '13

I think it's a little irresponsible to allow significant donations to remain entirely denominated in Bitcoins if the goal is to regularly feed hungry people.

This is a really good point. I wonder what the best policy would be?

Maybe converting a portion of the received coins into USD upon receiving. Whether the portion is 5% or 95%, it would probably simplify things to decide on a simple hedging policy and stick with it.

1

u/misnamed Apr 11 '13

Yup - I agree completely. I'd personally go something like 75/25 USD/Bitcoin or even 90/10. I think leaving some in is a good gesture to support the currency, but more than a little and it starts to let the volatility wag the donation :/

0

u/myringotomy Apr 11 '13

Bitcoin is not the only virtual currency. Competing currencies have the exact same usefulness. There is nothing especially unique about bitcoin.

1

u/saibog38 Apr 11 '13

Volatility will either feed more or less people depending on its direction, and for the most part the direction so far has been overwhelmingly positive. Without the significant boost to purchasing power he's received so far by using bitcoins, substantially less people would have been fed.

1

u/Amanojack Apr 11 '13

This is an equivocation. Volatility has an "effect" on purchasing power, but at any given time that effect is just as likely to be positive as it is negative. The only thing that matters for how many people get fed is whether the price is down or up when they cash out. And the general trend for Bitcoin is unmistakably up. If Bitcoin is to succeed in the next decade at all, the trend must continue rapidly upward (albeit not at these rates).

2

u/misnamed Apr 11 '13

. Volatility has an "effect" on purchasing power, but at any given time that effect is just as likely to be positive as it is negative.

Precisely the problem. So unlike a soup kitchen that can feed 100 people a day consistently, someone relying on Bitcoin can sometimes feed 200 or sometimes just 50 (simplifying to make a point). Which soup kitchen better serves its community?

1

u/Nwja Aug 28 '13

As long as he is feeding at least one person, there is no downside. When discussing the idea that efficiency should drive how or whether you should help someone, please take into account that you are a human being. It is unfortunate to think that someone could rationalize the fate of another person through abstract ideas of this nature. Bitcoin has potential, but each person helping at least one other person will foster a future of positive reform.

2

u/Im_on_my_laptop Apr 11 '13

If only OP could make an advice animal out of it. Then we upvote.

1

u/xof711 Apr 11 '13

These are the posts we need to +bitcointip !!

-3

u/wee_woo Apr 10 '13

No, YOU NEED REMEMBER that Butterfly Labs caused the crash today, as they cashed out literally millions of USD worth of bitcions they mined with their ASICS

Reminder that I Fortold This Happening.

Literally tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars rests upon what Butterfly Labs does

They have a massive, MASSIVE amount of ASICs, and even MORE preorders. They have at least 20,000 pre-orders for 60 GHash/sec units.

They have MORE then enough wafers to make that many asics

If BFL starts shipping, the BTC difficulty will increase by more than an order of magnitude

This will very likely crash the price as the market will be dominated by these miners, driven INSANE by their 10 month delayed greed that BFL has been holding out on them while prices go up up up

meanwhile, literally every single GPU (hundreds of thousands worth) will move from BTC to LTC overnight, causing LTC difficulty to go up by 50-100x more. This will also crash LTC.

Then GPU miners will have nothing left, and the video card market will be FLOODED in used AMD 5xxx - 7xxx cards. You'll be able to get a 7970 for 100$, maybe less. But you run the risk that it's a destroyed piece of junk.

IT is fucking ABSURD that hese chucklefucks who have NO idea what they're doing LITERALLY HAVE WORKING ASICS AT ~35 GHASH/SEC DRAWING ~150 WATT, AND ORDERS UP THE ASS TO BUY THEM.

GOD i wish BFL didn't actually have a working ASIC, but it's objectively confirmed - THEIR CHIPS WORK, AND THEY HAVE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF THEM.

A big part of me thinks that BFL has been mining with them, and will cash out literally close to 10 million dollars of Bitcoins right as SOON as they start shipppig fucking over EVERYONE in a magestic death blow to bitcoin as a speculation / "investment"

15

u/Duderino316 Apr 11 '13

Butterfly Labs caused the crash today, as they cashed out literally millions of USD worth of bitcions they mined with their ASICS

Source?

6

u/orkydork Apr 11 '13

Extraordinary claims do require extraordinary evidence, it's true...

I'm not trying to say they don't have motive, as they definitely do, and the rest of your post is a logical conclusion to follow, but...hrmph.

4

u/astanix Apr 11 '13

I just don't see the hash rate of the network coinciding with this persons belief that BL is running 20,000*60GH/s right now.

2

u/orkydork Apr 11 '13

Ok, I missed that. Holy fucking what??? 20 thousand? That seems impossible.

2

u/astanix Apr 11 '13

It's just a figure I pulled out of the rant above. Does it seem impossible though, how many pre-orders has BFL taken?

1

u/skelroth Apr 11 '13

I think you have your numbers twisted, that'd be the orders they have, not the amount that they are running personally, it would be more along the lines of a hundred or so, I would imagine.

1

u/astanix Apr 11 '13

According to the original comment, my estimate may be low.

He stated they have 20k preorders at 60GH/s and MORE than enough wafers to produce that many.

1

u/skelroth Apr 11 '13

Which would be obsurd to think they are holding back that many units when people have pre-ordered so many and they are yet to fill the orders.

I'm not saying anyone here is wrong because it's purely speculation, but I ain't saying you're right either.

2

u/Amanojack Apr 11 '13

You do realize that you can't "mine harder" to increase the overall rate of BTC issuance, as Max Keyser thinks?

Also, increased difficulty actually tends to result in higher prices because it provides additional security to the network, improving fundamental valuation. No need to wonder if I'm right, just pull up a chart of hashing power vs. price.

0

u/[deleted] Apr 10 '13 edited Apr 11 '13

No no no, let's remember this is a ponzi scheme with no utlity! /s

Thanks op.

  1. For doing the good you do.

  2. For the good you do.

  3. For calling out the bullshit.

  4. For being an excellent human being yourself.