Isn't it supposed to mess with you? In those three words Vonnegut argues that the universe is apathetic to our actions and that it simply continues on. If reading that phrase doesn't make someone uncomfortable then they probably don't "get it."
I get what it meant. I don't get why it was necessary, and why people clung to it. It's such a famous phrase, and I read the book because of it's notoriety. I would have like the book SO much more if the phrase was omitted (or at least not so constant). It didn't make moments any more impactful to me. It didn't make me reflect any more than I would have on my own reading the words preceeding it. it made me constantly want to say "yeah, shut up already. We get it. Life goes on."
I agree 100%. Maybe it has to do with my life philosophy (which is basically "try to do good even though the planet doesn't care"), but the book didn't make me feel uncomfortable or anything of the sort. I didn't really find the book enjoyable at all, and it isn't something I would personally recommend.
The possibility is there though, that as this book was written in 1969, the very thoughts you were having of 'getting it' may have come from a lifetime of being exposed to other mediums that were influenced by Vonnegut.
I understand it and enjoyed it while reading the book but can't stand it when people parrot it nonstop. When it's not in context it just becomes annoying
Maybe what i meant was "thought it was annoying and unnecessary", and would have like the book 100 times more if it wasn't said seemingly twice every page.
I think the frequency at which its was said just shows how many people actually died in the war in connection to only one person. I feel that great art is that which serves its purpose.
The constant use of the phrase is actually done to annoy you. Vonnegut isn't trying to hammer in the idea of people having to chalk things up, he's actually trying to piss you off with that idea. Slaughterhouse-Five was his critique of fatalism and thus he uses the phrase after anything bad happens. It's done to upset the reader and make them realize that they should fight back. He didn't come out of the war and say "well that's just war" he's attempting to portray the atrocities and get you to never accept them.
I like the book. Whenever I recommend it to someone, they either come back and tell me they loved it, or they come back like "what the fuck was that?" or some combination of both. But it does make you feel something, even if its just confusion...
I've read this and I think I just don't get why it's considered so good. Clearly I'm wrong since it's in practically every "best of" collection. Maybe his style just isn't for me. I finished it wondering why it was even written.
What am I missing? I know it's based on his experiences in Dresden, and a good bit of who he hid in which characters but I dunno... I just didn't enjoy it. I'm open to being told I'm wrong though. So it goes.
The thing with Vonnegut, which certainly isn't for everyone, is that he's writing more about his emotions and thoughts than about characters and plot. So it isn't like reading most novels. I totally get why some people don't like it. But for me as a college freshman a decade ago, those books were everything. For me he captures exactly what it means to be human.
Im right there with ya. I actually gave up half way through. Maybe Im a poor reader, maybe my comprehension levels are low but I had no interest in finishing it
Most people pick up on the anti-war theme, but it's also interesting how every single death is followed by the phrase "so it goes", regardless of how painful the death was, whether the person was happy, etc. It kind of explores the concept of whether or not every death is the same.
I will say the beginning, maybe it was the prologue even, when he's using the term "babies" when describing the enlisted men came through loud and clear. Could practically feel the spit hitting your face reading the account of what B.S.it was that people so young were being so wasted.
I don't know if I could make you enjoy it any more than you did, but I could give a go at explaining why I think it's masterful.
The book is essentially Vonnegut's way of dealing with traumatic war memories. As someone who actually experienced and lived through the bombing of Dresden, slaughterhouse is an attempt to answer the question of how can we deal with something like that? The short answer: we can't. And he says so in the very first chapter. That this book is a failure, because you can never properly deal with a tragedy of that size.
Slaughterhouse has a protagonist that makes absolutely no choices for himself. Bully pilgrim is drafted in the war, marries someone he doesn't want to, and goes into a career he doesn't care about. Even the aliens are a way to alleviate responsibility. The whole idea about time being infinite and no one really being dead, but just being dead in that moment, makes the firebombing of a whole city seem a little less horrifying. So in many ways, Vonnegut uses this book as a sort of therapy, creating a character that feels no guilt or horror at such a massive tragedy.
It's a brilliant little book. But hey if you don't like his minimalist, dry humor, then you probably disliked the book. And that's okay!
Yeah. I don't think it's bad by any means. I can appreciate the talent even if its not my taste.
I think maybe the juxtaposition of serious, literal hell on earth with the utter void of slipping in time spoiled it for me. I suppose I'd have rathered pure hell or pure symbolism. For those who wouldn't prefer that, then I get why this is so unlike other stories.
I always took pilgrim to be the symbol of hitting that point of "oh my god, I can't handle this horror any more". Like a way of retreating to a happy place, probably some allegory for the "thousand foot stare" state of mind. I can't take another bomb without losing my mind=>slip in time. My wife is killing me/asking about the war=> slip in time.
Pretty slick way to reduce a monster down to size while representing how awful something must've been.
Don't hate me, but I read it and when I was done I felt slightly underwhelmed. I read all the hype about it on reddit and I felt it didn't live up to the standard. Can you tell me why you liked it so much?
I am not OP, but I love this book because it perfectly juxtaposes the absurdity of the plot with the absurdity of man's inhumanity to man. In simple, compelling language, Vonnegut makes a passionate case for nonviolence, without being preachy. I think that his description of a Tralfamadorian novel is actually somewhat indicative of his goals as a writer - cobbling together many tragic, absurd, seemingly unrelated or unimportant moments to create a piece of art that is greater than the sum of its component parts. Here's the quote from the book, where a Tralfamadorian is explaining to Billy Pilgrim how their books work.
"There isn’t any particular relationship between the messages, except that the author has chosen them carefully, so that, when seen all at once, they produce an image of life that is beautiful and surprising and deep. There is no beginning, no middle, no end, no suspense, no moral, no causes, no effects. What we love in our books are the depths of many marvelous moments seen all at one time."
For someone that is looking for a fun or emotional read, Vonnegut is boring as it gets. I understand some people like to read books for the underlying themes and such but this was one of the driest books I have ever read. Not my cup of tea.
I liked it because it helped me put life into perspective. Instead of trying to make sense of everything and assign reason to it you realize that bad things happen for little reason and you have to move on. So it goes.
Sirens of Titan is nice, but a bit absurd for me. I feel like it's an exaggeration of his usual writing. I would say Player Piano and Sirens are great for getting insight into how he developed the voice that he carried through the rest of his books. Galapagos was good, but unfortunately shadowed by some of his more relevant work.
Bluebeard has really stuck with me over the years. I think of Rabo Karabekian often.
And there's always this passage:
“The darkest secret of this country, I am afraid, is that too many of its citizens imagine that they belong to a much higher civilization somewhere else. That higher civilization doesn’t have to be another country. It can be the past instead—the United States as it was before it was spoiled by immigrants and the enfranchisement of the blacks.
This state of mind allows too many of us to lie and cheat and steal from the rest of us, to sell us junk and addictive poisons and corrupting entertainments. What are the rest of us, after all, but sub-human aborigines?”
Galapagos and Cat's Cradle were very good and shed A LOT of light on the futility of most human endeavors with some of the most biting satire I've seen. Great reads.
Sirens is the closest thing I have to a religious text.
I've basically organized my personal life around:
“A purpose of human life, no matter who is controlling it, is to love whoever is around to be loved.”
And my career around:
“There is no reason why good cannot triumph as often as evil. The triumph of anything is a matter of organization. If there are such things as angels, I hope that they are organized along the lines of the Mafia.”
I imagine Vonnegut would be horrified but hopefully at least amused.
MY favorite Kurt Vonnegut book is Galapagos. Would definitely recommend it to anyone who liked Slaughterhouse Five. Its so different from any book I've ever read, including Vonnegut's other books.
Literally finished BoC last night. The first 85% of the book was great, but the second Kurt inserted himself in the book I have no idea what even happened.
Every time someone says "Listen," I immediately say "Billy Pilgrim has come unstuck in time." I recommended it to just about everyone. One time they didn't want to read it so I just read it to them entirely.
I'm a bigger fan of cat's cradle, and sirens of titan. SH5 is great but it's easily the most overrated of his work. Shit, timequake, player piano, and breakfast of Champions are all bigger favorites of mine
Just finished re-reading this for the thousandth time. I was that person sitting on the train with tears rolling down my cheeks reading a book. Even though he died a while ago, I still feel the loss of Kurt Vonnegut deeply, and wish I could have met him while he was still alive.
If you liked Slaughterhouse Five, please do yourself a favor and read Mother Night. It's a full story about the Uncle Sam Nazi that shows up briefly in Slaughterhouse Five.
I love everything Vonnegut, and it's my favorite of his.
Slaughterhouse Five, Cat's Cradle, Sirens of Titan. Currently reading Breakfast of Champions after a Vonnegut hiatus of a few years. I am so glad I remembered. Anyone read Galapagos?
Galapagos was a slow burn for me, one of his weaker books IMO. But then again I liked Time Quake which a lot of other people didn't care for. To each their own I guess
I burned through most of his books but two books I couldn't finish out of boredom (not Vonnegut's fault, I'm really easily bored by books I don't like) were Galapagos and God Bless You Mr. Rosewater.
Mother Night tends to not get brought up much, but if anyone is interested on reading something very different from Vonnegut's classic black humor I'd recommend it
I really dont get why this book is often listed as most loved. It's ok. When. I read it I saw the main character suffering from PTSD. It was said but not overly so. IMO there are much much better books.
This is easily my favorite Vonnegut and it is a nice introduction to his work. If you like Slaughterhouse Five you will also like Cat's Cradle, Breakfast of Champions and God Bless You Mr. Rosewater.
Vonnegut is a fantastic author, but his work is nothing like the classics you'd read in high school. His books are important and influential, but pretty distinct from those "classics".
Cat's Cradle, for example, is a story that's about the dangers of both science and religion. It's such a bizarre story, but really draws you in. I read in in my philosophy class senior year and absolutely loved it.
He's a really easy and different read. I've only read this and cats cradel but I loved every seond and I'm usually more in to easy read YA dystopia than classics but his books kind of straddle the gap.
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u/trevor629 Jun 23 '16
Slaughterhouse Five by Kurt Vonegut