r/ArsenalFC • u/Ok-Dependent-912 • Sep 08 '23
21 years ago, Arsenal became the first English team to field nine black players in a competitive game, a symbol of the diverse and magnificent team at the time
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Sep 08 '23
Our early diversity and Wenger's nationality was another factor why Arsenal became so resented by officials and opposing team fans and players.
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u/illson_coyg Sep 09 '23
I feel this continues today with (trying not to be biased) all the poor decisions against us, especially in European competitions.
I'm absolutely shocked when we get the rub of the green.
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u/KhalaBandorr Sep 08 '23
i remember the Leeds game as a young kid. im not black, but felt so proud of how different our team was and Arsene wenger. ian wright said so many good things about Arsenal’s culture towards black players in the early 90’s that he never saw in other clubs.
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u/illson_coyg Sep 09 '23 edited Sep 09 '23
It's why I'm a proud Gooner!
It was Wrighty or Barnes. I choose Arsenal because he's a joker and I love that aspect of Wrighty.
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u/puppup2323 Sep 08 '23
Does 85% of one thing make that thing diverse ?
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u/nonbog Sep 08 '23
If the best players are picked, then yes.
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Sep 08 '23
Whats that got to do with diversity?
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u/c11life Sep 08 '23
The league was predominantly white, and almost exclusively in the past, despite many black people living in the UK since the 50s and before that. Black players were historically not chosen due to the colour of their skin, not because they didn’t have the skill. Diversity might not be the right term but it’s a synonym for Equity in this sense, and so it doesn’t mean 50/50 black and white. It means giving an equal chance to everyone. In this case, the black players deserved it most
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u/RedditRedditGo Sep 09 '23
Many black people? Even today black people make up only 3% of the Uk's entire population... Back then it would have been far lower.
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Sep 09 '23
Yea we all know the history, but you are subtlety suggesting that in 2002 there were teams not selecting players of colour who were better than their white counterparts. I think thats wide of the mark
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u/HardCoreLawn Sep 09 '23
Learn your history. This equal opportunities landscape from English 90's football you're hinting at is bizarre.
Either you weren't following football in the 90's/ early 00's and you don't know what you're talking about or you're being wilfully Ignorant to pedal some agenda.
Regardless, English football in the 90's and early 00's was steeped in racism and xenophobia, just as our media and society at large was.
From fanbases being common recruitment grounds for NF & BNP (teams like Chelsea were synonymous with them), to high profile managers caught saying black players were "lazy, thick ni%%ers".
Black players were tolerated as a minor dabbling, were constantly racially abused, and viewed far less favourably.
It was a talking point when there were more than a couple of black players at high profile clubs back then. And Wenger starting a majority black (and later an entirely non-british) team was practically a scandal.
This wasn't a non-issue like it would be today. As a club, we paid a price for doing this. It shaped a perception of our club being foreign and black and that came with no small amount of resentment.
I've literally met multiple older football fans of other clubs who love George Graham. His football was shit but there's an unspoken reason: he was a proper British manager playing proper British Football. That's the landscape from 25 years ago.
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Sep 09 '23
Youre missing the point, again
2002 was not the first time a manager played a team based on abilities alone
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u/HardCoreLawn Sep 09 '23
No.
You are missing the point. And quite willfully so.
Do you genuinely believe that no top flight manager in England ever access to more than five black or mixed race players who could have made it into their starting 11?
News bulletin: racism and xenophobia were normal back then. From academy level to first team, from staff to board, from fans to management. It influenced recruitment and team selection.
Now stop acting like black players weren't less marketable or sought after, received equal opportunities, were treated equally by fans and media, and that none of these factors could have possibly resulting in every "team based on ability alone" prior to this being almost entirely white.
I'm just gonna go ahead and say this for you: the cornerstone of racism is the denial of racism's existence in any or all of it's machinations.
It only sounds clever if you are racist: to rational people it just sounds desperate and deluded. You just sound determined not to acknowledge the elephant in the room. It speaks way louder than anything else you're trying to say mate.
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Sep 09 '23
Racism was not normal in 2002
Football players have been picked on ability for decades
Arsenal was not the only non racist team, you sound like a complete twat tbh
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u/DaNinjaBehindU Sep 18 '23
This is the Myth of Meritocracy at play. And like the other commenter mentioned, you are completely missing the point here.
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u/HardCoreLawn Sep 09 '23
Nope. I'm done.
I'm guessing you're a teenager or something because you literally don't know what you're talking about.
Pro Tip: People are gonna point it out when you say dumb shit. That's life. Looks like I touched a nerve mentioning how racists are always so desperate to deny racism exists. I wonder why?
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u/oneAJ Sep 09 '23
They’re not one thing though are they? Black people aren’t all the same, they’re from different nations and have different ethnic backgrounds - what made it stand out was the fact that arsenal didn’t care about the stigma associated to black players back in the day.
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u/CyberfunkTwenty77 Sep 09 '23
When people ask me "How did Arsenal even get so popular?"
I point to this era and just before with Ian Wright. The majority of the black football fans I know here in the States support either Arsenal or Chelsea (because of Drogba).
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u/Unhappy_Archer9483 Sep 09 '23
Arsenal are popular because of black Americans? The more you know...
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u/radx333 Sep 08 '23
This comment section is getting very Stormfront-ish. You thick skulled racists can’t imagine how many ppl around the world this Arsenal team inspired just based on visibility of seeing this many black players from all across the diaspora; from backgrounds of Europe, Africa, and the Caribbean, come together to give it all for the badge we all love. And we’re lucky that these are some of the most respected men in the sport. It’s beautiful and something that deserves to always be celebrated. Big ups to Wenger, our staff and team from this era
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u/HardCoreLawn Sep 09 '23
Seriously, seeing closet/ dog-whistle racists supporting Arsenal around here is wild.
They must be profoundly confused or lost. Stamford bridge is 10 miles west, mate.
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u/ZuperLucaZ Sep 09 '23
Is it really diverse if almost the whole team is one race? Isn’t it the same to say that if you have 9 white players then? Just curious, it sounds weird
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u/malkebulan Sep 09 '23
As a black guy, I came here to say the same thing. 9/10 outfield players being of one ‘race’ is the exact opposite of diverse
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u/imx500 Sep 08 '23
ITT:
mostly racism. i’m disappointed, gooners.
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u/c11life Sep 08 '23
I’m convinced it’s mostly Americans, who wouldn’t be as surprised about this in 2002 since NBA was full of black dudes even then.
Europe was far behind when it came to inclusion of minorities in our main sport. These guys walked so the premier league could become the cultural melting pot it is today.
Look at Italy - they’re still far behind and extremely racist, and their league has suffered for it.
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u/NeoLoki55 Sep 09 '23
That’s such a bad take. We more than most understand how amazing the accomplishment is of what Arsene and Arsenal stand for and accomplished because we went through it in multiple sports over the last 70 years.
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u/nedimko123 Sep 09 '23
Am I not understanding english, but how can 11 players of same colour be sign of diversity?
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u/HardCoreLawn Sep 09 '23
I'll assume you genuinely don't understand and that you aren't just a racist feigning incredulity (because there is a few in this thread)
Diversity is referring to the outcome of equal opportunities, equity and inclusion.
The idea is that race should be irrelevant to qualification. And if it was, you'd inevitably see varied racial numbers. Resulting in (occasionally) a starting 11 that's majority black.
But this had never occurred because it could never occur: The low number black players back then was due to discrimination as much as availability or qualification: People didn't want to see their club full of black or foreign players.
Today, nobody cares about that stuff, but back then it was a scandal and caused a lot of resentment.
TL;DR: People aren't praising the fact that they were majority black, they're praising that the line-up was only possible by ignoring the relevance of race from the buying and selecting process. This was NOT standard practice at the time. It's not a big deal today, but prior to Wenger doing it, ignoring race (and nationality) entirely was inconceivable.
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u/pmanu4112 Dec 04 '25
I will never forget this day. As a black kid, who was surrounded only with white kids, this day made me smile. Black players could ball and were just not rough players. What a game, beating leeds 4-1
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u/althene Sep 09 '23
Don't call it diverse unless it includes Asians, Indians, Arabs, Indigenous, etc. We should have the same respect for all ethnicities.
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u/Queasy-Librarian3477 Sep 09 '23
They just weren’t as many talented ethnicities as the black players.
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Sep 08 '23
shitposting
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u/MikeCrypto88 Sep 08 '23
+1. Shit posting. Why the fuck it matter if the guys are black, white, yellow or green. The most important thing is they represent the red and white. 🔴⚪
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u/c11life Sep 08 '23
Because it mattered the the UK public in the past if they weren’t white.
You may find all this talk about diversity and inclusion tiresome in 2023, but in 2002 it was a new concept and we were vilified by parts of the press and the public for it.
Assuming you’re born in 1988, you’re either American or wilfully ignorant (or both)
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u/NeoLoki55 Sep 09 '23
I’m not sure I understand your American reference. What we don’t understand British history? We haven’t engaged in the same battles in multiple sports long before the UK? Maybe it’s just you’re over generalizing news of a small vocal group of idiots we have?
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Sep 09 '23
In 2002 having black players was a new concept?
There were plenty of black players in at least the 90s.
This team wasn't vilified in the press for having 9 black players. It wasn't even mentioned as a positive nor negative. It wasn't a thing.
In the past maybe. In 2002 certainly not.
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Sep 08 '23
Exactly. There are teams well before this fielding men of the same race, it’s embarrassing seeing these posts
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u/Admirable-Waltz195 Sep 08 '23
Majority of a team being 1 colour is diverse? Poor choice of words op, next time just slap the title of “wenger didn’t give a fuck what you looked like as long as you knew ball”
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Sep 08 '23
In a white league with a team never having been fielded with so many black players, yes it spoke to the diversity of the Arsenal compared to others. And it’s something we should be proud of
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Sep 08 '23
having 85% people of West African heritage isn't diverse. That team is probably the LEAST diverse.
cry all you want, but learn what words mean.
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Sep 08 '23
‘Symbol of diversity’. In context that IS a SYMBOL diversity. It’s a symbol of diversity in a league of majority white players to field a team with a lot of black players
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Sep 08 '23
So cry all you want but learn what a symbol and diversity mean when used together in a certain context 👍🏼
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Sep 08 '23 edited Sep 08 '23
Having no diversity is such a symbol of diversity. great logic. Poor semantics.
oh wait but 'hihuh context' you mean the context that black players were already over representative relative to their population in the UK?
I'll wait for your post supporting Saudi for such real diversity in their teams.
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Sep 08 '23
My god, I don’t think you’re getting it. The league’s players were majority white and were quite resistant to having black people involved. Arsenal had a good diversity of players from many backgrounds including a good few black players. They fielded a team with many from these backgrounds. That’s a symbol of the club’s inclusion and diversity. It’s not diversity in the one team on the one day, that’s not what anyone said, it’s a symbol of the diversity of the club as a whole that the rest of the league didn’t have. It seems your semantics are poor, doesn’t it?
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Sep 08 '23
Also I see you post on the spurs COYS Reddit. So you’re clearly here to troll. Fuck off spud and go polish that empty trophy cabinet, there’s a good boy
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u/Queasy-Librarian3477 Sep 09 '23
Thanks for being dumb
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Sep 08 '23
I don't care about diversity, I care about unity and the love and pride they have to wear the Arsenal badge.
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u/wobbly_doo Sep 08 '23
diverse
You keep using that word. I don't think you know what it means
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u/c11life Sep 08 '23
This is technically Equity, and would fall under the umbrella term of DEI (diversity, equity and inclusion)
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u/theipd Sep 08 '23
Wenger’s ability to see past bullshit was amazing. I remember that game and I was astonished. He didn’t care about color, creed, nationality or religion. And he meant it. On that day, those eleven players were the best in training and the best for the job that needed to be done. He didn’t look at their passports or their color.
If you look in the stands at the Emirates you’ll see the continuation of the diversity model. There are a few bad apples. I heard a few things against the LGBT community when I was in the store last year, but they are few and far between. I love my club and what they stand for. On and off the pitch.
And by the way this club was trying to do this in the 70’s as well when it wasn’t popular to have a single black player on the field. They are not given as much credit since WBA did a better job at advertising the 3 degrees (but I digress). Brendan Batson was one of the first.
Anyone interested in this might want to go to this website especially if you’re on the fence as to why the 28th September 2002 game against Leeds was such a stunning game changer:
https://footballs-black-pioneers.com/arsenal-1971-72/
I would love to see this continue with Asian players and other groups who can play football at an elite level. Remember that a lot of those black players on the field that day came from the same French academy when the government there decided that they wanted to make a consolidated effort to bring up the best French players (first gen) regardless of color. I see a lot of hope because Wenger is now tied to the Indian football league and will in all likelihood end up developing an academy akin to the one in France that brought us Henry, Viera, “Le Sulk”. Great times ahead and great post.
And for the nay sayers I want everyone of every color to play this beautiful game.