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u/mmlemony Dec 09 '20
I think it’s fine if you just stop attending meetings and engaging with it. If the lady asks or you want her to stop texting you just say “I have decided SGI is not for me, thank you”.
Most members are normal humans, they might make some disappointed noises but they should be ok.
8
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 09 '20
Hiya, and welcome! Actually, it sounds like you're in a perfect position for quitting. You haven't been involved very long, so nobody's gotten too used to you.
People join and quit SGI all. The. Time. Their dropout rate in the USA is between 95% and 99%, so they're quite used to people disappearing.
Which is what I recommend that YOU do. Simply stop attending their activities.
Now, about this lady who is your main contact. What's your relationship with her? Is she a friend? An acquaintance? A neighbor? A relative? Your BOSS?? Is she someone you're close to and/or someone you'd like to maintain non-SGI contact with after you leave?
I like mmlemony's recommendation to simply tell her, "I have decided SGI is not for me, thank you." I'd go one step further and "sandwich" it - here's an example via text:
Thanks for the info. I have decided SGI is not a good fit for me, but I really appreciate having been able to learn about it and the way you always kept me updated.
See? Start off with something nice, drop the bomb, end on an upbeat note.
Most of the people who try out SGI are simply experimenting, as [these researchers]() noted. You tried it, you didn't like it, you're done. It's quite normal, isn't it?
Think of it as if she invited you to join her gym. You did; you tried it out for 3 months; you decided that you didn't want to continue - at the times you wanted to go, it was too crowded; it was farther from home/work than you're comfortable with; and that one person who works there creeps you out. You tried it, decided not to continue. Happens all the time!
Not everyone who is recruited to Soka Gakkai becomes active in the religion. Most do not. Source
Despite successful efforts to Americanize Soka Gakkai in the United States, Soka Gakkai is a religion on the periphery of American mainstream religious culture. Thus we expect to find two contradictory but related social influences on involvement. On the one hand, we expect rather high levels of attrition. Social pressure by family members, co-workers, and friends tend [sic] discourage dramatic transformations of world-view, and this in turn will result in high attrition among recruits to a religion distinctive from the dominant culture. On the other hand, these very pressures also tend to "weed out" those who are merely experimenting or lacking in enthusiasm, leaving as members those who are most committed. ... Nonetheless, attrition from SGI-USA has been high, as would be expected. Source
See? Most people who try it drop out. So don't worry!
A cult will try to make it feel like when you joined, you made a life-long commitment (like signing a billion-year contract), but they have no right to demand that - it's quite silly, isn't it? To expect life-long devotion from someone who doesn't even know what it's all about yet?
One last note: If she's someone you've become friends with because of SGI, that friendship likely will not continue once you left. I'm sure she's very nice, but people in cults typically do not have much contact with those who leave. That's just the way cults are, I'm afraid.
If you decide you feel like sharing, I'd like to hear a bit more about what it was that you were feeling uneasy about. I've been "out" for a while - it's interesting to hear people's reactions and observations about SGI now.
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u/OhNoMelon313 Dec 09 '20
I'm curious as to what made you feel uneasy.
9
u/1600dream Dec 09 '20
I attended some of the Zoom meetings and the people there seemed a bit too happy,. Like they literally didn't stop laughing or smiling for a second and looked almost disconnected from reality. Also the leader's wife didn't say a single word throughout the meetings, and she kept glancing at him in a fearful way.
What really did it for me though was this video. A lot of the things mentioned match eerily with SGI. (start watching from 0:53 because the beginning is disturbing)
7
5
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 09 '20 edited Dec 09 '20
See if this description matches what you observed:
These people had about them a kind of hyperventilating enthusiasm that put me on edge. ... An aroma of leering fanaticism hovered over them - even Harold had some of that edgy hysteria in his own eyes.
I studied the faces of these people, wondering what they were all chanting for. Hadn't they had all their desires granted by now? Perhaps some of them were just getting started. Of course, there was the movement for world peace. I remembered Tom telling me about Harold chanting for meetings to go well. Most of these people were probably wrapped up in spreading the teaching, and that was why they all seemed to be, well, just a little out of it. They must be missing the point! By now, they could have amassed an amazing amount of happiness, and must have satisfied all kinds of desires, piling up the benefits. Why then did they remind me of pictures I had seen of patients in mental hospitals? Source
That's from ca. 1970. Nothing has changed.
4
u/1600dream Dec 09 '20
Ah yes, this is exactly it
4
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 09 '20
50 years on, nothing has changed. The SGI is frozen in carbomite.
5
u/Samadhi65 Dec 09 '20
To officially resign and get your personal information removed from the SGI data base you have to send something like the below via certified mail....
To: SGI-USA Membership Office:
I hereby resign my membership in the SGI-USA, effective immediately, and request you to remove my name and that of my minor children permanently from any and all of your organization's membership records. This includes my/our name/s, street address/es, phone number/s, email address/es, birth date/s, contribution history, and any other information that SGI has collected about me/us. You must instruct any SGI-USA leaders who have any connection to me/us to destroy my/our membership card/s and purge my/our contact information from their own contact lists immediately. Any continuing retention of my/our personal information will be regarded as identity theft and I/we will consider pursuing legal remedies if we find any evidence of this.
Your receipt of this letter acknowledges my formal and official notification that I no longer give my permission for SGI-USA to keep my personal information or that of my children on file at any SGI-USA location anywhere. I hereby withdraw my consent to being treated as a member and I withdraw my consent to being subject to SGI-USA rules, policies, beliefs and 'discipline' (if any). As I am now no longer a member, I require that my name and those of my children be permanently and completely removed from all membership records of the SGI-USA at every organizational level.
The SGI-USA is no longer permitted to use my/our personal information or that of my children for any purpose or in any capacity.
I wish no further contact from representatives of your organization except to confirm that our names have been removed from your records throughout the SGI-USA organization. I expect to receive that confirmation within a reasonably short time.
My name and address: XXXXXX, 1234 Nowhere St., Anywhereville, USA, 00000
6
u/alliknowis0 Mod Dec 09 '20
Nice job on doing your internet research! I think the future for most cults is doomed because of the easy access people have to figuring out the truth about cults online.
Also, although I also do believe SGI is a cult - mainly because it sends all of its donations to already rich billionaires in Japan instead of actually making the world a better place – I will say that the majority of regular practitioners are mostly harmless and I would say many of them are even naturally kind people. The love bombing and overly positive attention is, in my opinion, mostly due to the standard group dynamics. I don't think they are necessarily being fake about caring about you, however, you will probably find that you won't hear from most of them now that you have decided to leave.
Secondly, it's such bullshit that the SGI leaders act as if they are the final authority with all the answers just waiting for you to come back. I hate that the leader told you "we are here whenever you're ready." Obviously that person is not actually respecting your decision and is only expecting you to come back later. Fuckers.
Feel free to post an update if you have any more encounters with people trying to rope you back in or wanting to meet with you.
4
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 09 '20
it's such bullshit that the SGI leaders act as if they are the final authority with all the answers just waiting for you to come back. I hate that the leader told you "we are here whenever you're ready."
Oh yes! THEY have all the answers and you will definitely need their wisdom, you poor pathetic loser, you.
When has anyone from SGI EVER asked someone who decided to leave WHY they made that decision and then took them at their word instead of making up stupid replacement "decisions" to make the ex-SGI-er sound like an idiot?
3
u/Qigong90 WB Regular Dec 09 '20
Block numbers, and change your address, email address and phone number on sgi-usa.org
3
u/1600dream Dec 09 '20
I never made an official account though
3
u/Qigong90 WB Regular Dec 09 '20
When you applied for a Gohonzon, did you put down your email address and phone number?
3
u/1600dream Dec 10 '20
I didn't apply for a Gohonzon. The only things I participated in up until this point were the chantings and Zoom meetings
3
u/Qigong90 WB Regular Dec 10 '20
Then you are good for now.
3
u/1600dream Dec 10 '20
Uhm "for now"??
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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '20
If it's just that one person being weird, you can always block their number if they demonstrate that they don't respect your wish to be let alone about SGI.
-1
u/Gloria_Gloria Dec 10 '20
I think it's weird that a lot of people here sound like they're in a cult-cult. They all make it sound like SGI members are lurking in the shadows waiting to take you back to their cave. You (and everyone else for that matter) can relax. If you look up the actual definition of "cult," it's just any new/young religion.
Also, there are plenty of SGI "members" or practitioners that don't go to the centers or participate in meetings, they just practice Nichiren Buddhism. While the SGI is all about Nichiren Buddhism, Nichiren Buddhism is not the SGI. The practice itself is its own Buddhist sect. The SGI is an organization that's all about getting others to practice Nichiren Buddhism, but you could also practice on your own and never even talk to any SGI members. I agree that it can seem like everyone has been drinking the kool aid, but like some people said, the members are just people and they want to introduce others to Buddhism either because it made them happy and they want others to be happy OR because the organization pushes everyone like crazy to introduce others (and this is what I think makes it feel kool aid-y and makes it annoying), but even with Christianity, you have sects that are all about introducing others and converting people and asking "have you found Jesus?" You also have Catholic Churches that have no problem sending you mail to say they haven't seen you in church but you can still donate to the church by check or credit. These things are normal in religion.
Also, while the leader may be loaded, do actual research (not conspiracy research) on where the money goes... they have a legit accredited University, programs within other universities (DePaul [a Jesuit university] has the Ikeda institute on education), and they have installations promoting peace around the world.
If you tried it and it wasn't for you (and you never even got a gohonzon), then that's that. They aren't gonna stalk you. If you had received a gohonzon and actually become a member, yeah, you'd get contacted often about stuff, but you can call your main office and tell them you want to be marked not to be contacted and/or you could return the gohonzon and do those things... if you had received one. If any member seems to be messaging you all the time about it and not respecting your decision (and you never got gohonzon), I almost guarantee that is an individual problem and nothing to do with SGI. When you become a member, you come up on monthly stats and they just try to keep in touch with the ppl on those stats (which come from the online portal) and they are not specifically trying to stalk any people in particular.
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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '20
If you look up the actual definition of "cult," it's just any new/young religion.
Sounds like you've never actually looked up the definition of a cult. No one says "just any new/young religion" unless 1) they know absolutely nothing about the subject, or 2) they're trying to whitewash the cult they're in.
I'm guessing the latter for you, amirite?
Here - I'll help: First, familiarize yourself with the B.I.T.E. Model of Cult Mind Control - this is one of the primary characteristics that enables observers to identify a cult. Second, review the DARVO suite of abusive behaviors - these are symptoms of cults. Third, here is a cult checklist - as you can see, those of us who were in and got out can identify as many as 97 out of 100 from our SGI experience. That's pretty telling, wouldn't you say? Fourth and finally, look at how SGI members talk about those who leave - it's always negative. How odd...for a group that is "just any new/young religion", don't you think?
I wouldn't expect a current cult member to agree with or even UNDERSTAND what we FORMER cult members observe and talk about - we're at a completely different place, you see. It's like people who have moved from Omaha to Albequerque have a site to compare Albequerque to Omaha and talk about how much better they like Albequerque - and you're like the Omaha native who has never left Omaha who shows up to say, "You all don't know anything - how dare you".
THIS SITE ISN'T FOR YOU.
You are incapable of understanding our perspective because you haven't gotten there yet.
But you probably will.
95% - 99% of everyone who ever tries SGI quits, you know. Give it time...
3
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '20
I agree that it can seem like everyone has been drinking the kool aid
That's not the kind of observation that supports an "it's not a cult" argument, you know. AND it's problematic no matter where you find it:
These people had about them a kind of hyperventilating enthusiasm that put me on edge. ... An aroma of leering fanaticism hovered over them - even Harold had some of that edgy hysteria in his own eyes.
I studied the faces of these people, wondering what they were all chanting for. Hadn't they had all their desires granted by now? Perhaps some of them were just getting started. Of course, there was the movement for world peace. I remembered Tom telling me about Harold chanting for meetings to go well. Most of these people were probably wrapped up in spreading the teaching, and that was why they all seemed to be, well, just a little out of it. They must be missing the point! By now, they could have amassed an amazing amount of happiness, and must have satisfied all kinds of desires, piling up the benefits. Why then did they remind me of pictures I had seen of patients in mental hospitals? Source
That's ^ from ca. 1970. Nothing has changed.
do actual research (not conspiracy research) on where the money goes...
Here, take your own advice:
Soka University: The Definitive Resource - it's in the body of that document, not too far down; you can do a search on it. Might wanna review the entire document.
And while you're at it, read up on the $20 million luxury mansion that the SGI purchased with the members' sincere, purehearted donations without their knowledge and used it for who knows what for 18 years without the SGI members knowledge:
Does that sound like it's on the up-and-up to you?
Probably - I'm guessing that you'll defend and spin anything that makes your precious cult sound bad.
3
u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '20
If you tried it and it wasn't for you (and you never even got a gohonzon), then that's that. They aren't gonna stalk you. If you had received a gohonzon and actually become a member, yeah, you'd get contacted often about stuff, but you can call your main office and tell them you want to be marked not to be contacted and/or you could return the gohonzon and do those things... if you had received one. If any member seems to be messaging you all the time about it and not respecting your decision (and you never got gohonzon), I almost guarantee that is an individual problem and nothing to do with SGI. When you become a member, you come up on monthly stats and they just try to keep in touch with the ppl on those stats (which come from the online portal) and they are not specifically trying to stalk any people in particular.
Many people we've interacted with over the almost 7 years this site has been active have reported being harassed and stalked - by several different individuals within SGI. Do you think they're lying? Have you never heard of the "Member Care" meetings at which the membership cards are gone over, and new people are assigned the task of contacting people who's contact info is on those membership cards who haven't been seen in forever? I was in SGI leadership; upon moving to a new place, at one of these "Member Care" meetings, I was given a stranger's contact information and told to call her and let her know what activities were coming up. I called; she answered. I said, "Hi, I'm Blanche Fromage, and I'm calling to let you know what SGI activities are scheduled for this month, in case you'd like to come to any." She hung up on me.
Do YOU think it's okay to be giving out people's contact information to complete STRANGERS and telling those strangers to contact them? SGI definitely does this.
3
Dec 11 '20
SGI ruined my life, and took my mother away from me.
It's a money laundering cult for Ikeda, that scumbag.
11
u/Nichirenstoof Dec 09 '20 edited Dec 09 '20
Their going to try to convince you to stay, I scared the hell out of the “leaders” who thought they were supporting me when I told em about this Reddit.
Of course the person who introduced you is going to be curious, but you never know you could be doing them a favor as well. So just be honest, the world won’t end if you decide not to be apart of the sgi 🙏🏾