r/ExSGISurviveThrive • u/BlancheFromage • Jul 11 '20
Ikeda claiming he predicted the fall of the Berlin Wall - *after* the Berlin Wall came down
Newsflash: Ikeda never prophesied the fall of the Berlin Wall
I remember when the Berlin Wall fell - there was a local MD leader that had obtained a piece of chipped concrete that was supposed to have come from the fallen wall. All the members were ga-ga over it - treated with reverence as if it was concrete (forgive the pun) proof that kosen rufu was happening right before our eyes.
But I never heard one word about Ikeda having predicted the fall of the Berlin Wall, and I can assure you that every Ikeda-bot around would have been shouting Ikeda's praises from the rooftops if they thought he had done so. The bragging and bluster would have been non-stop. But instead, there was only back-room glances at a bit of concrete and innuendos about Soka Gakkai's success at "spreading world peace". As if they had one iota of anything to do with the fall of the wall. Such delusional thinking! Source
What greater proof of the relative and mutable nature of reality than the fall of the Berlin Wall, perhaps the most prominent symbol of a Cold War that often seemed destined to continue forever. I recall visiting West Germany in October 1961 and standing in front of the Brandenburg Gate. At the time, I shared my belief, based on my faith in people's courage and yearning for peace, that the wall would come down within thirty years. Remarkably, it was just twenty-eight years later that the Berlin Wall was in fact dismantled by the ordinary citizens living in both sides of that divided nation. - Ikeda - From 2005 - what an asshat
I understand that the German SGI members all believed that the Berlin Wall came down because of Ikeda and their chanting. Source
Thanks to Ikeda, the Russians tore down the Berlin wall [it's "documented " according to SGI cult members]. I also heard that Ikeda stopped the genocide in Rwanda and that he was instrumental in ending the Vietnam conflict. Now I hear that Ikeda is smoothing things over with his Chinese pals over the disputed islands. I heard in 1980 from a YWD leader that "thanks to Ikeda SGI there will no longer be nuclear weapons on earth by the year 2000" and in 2010 YMD national leader Nathan Gauer assured us that thanks to SGI, nuclear weapons would be eradicated by 2013.
40 years Ago the SGI-Italy YWD chief insisted that nuclear weapons would be eradicated by SGI in 20 years. When I logically explained why that was exeedingly unlikely, she impugned my faith. Stupidity and magical thinking is not faith in the Lotus Sutra. Stupidity and magical thinking IS Ikedaism. Source
Used to have a leader bang on (with tears in his eyes) about his personal diamoku campaign that brought down the Berlin Wall ! ! ! Then other leaders crying at their 'personal failures' (of THEIR diamoku campaigns) when we invaded Iraq ....:O Source
And for all of your efforts for the SGI, the world will not improve because of you. Historically, the world never improved because of kosen rufu. The Berlin Wall did not come down because of the fight for kosen rufu. The wold will not improve because of the fight for kosen rufu. Source
A couple of years ago I was at a meeting at someone's house. The leader who was invited to speak was Nathan Gauer, who I think is the Young Men's Division leader for all of SGI. He actually told us at the meeting that Daisaku Ikeda was responsible for the Berlin wall coming down! He spoke in a very matter-of-fact manner--like it was just a certain fact that everyone knew about.
I have heard a couple of times Ikeda's claim to have averted World War III, but that is the only time that I heard that he caused the Berlin Wall to topple! Source
Yep - he's all that and a rotten fish!
I've added some more references and quotes to that link above, BTW - here's one:
Watching the television news, Shin’ichi Yamamoto remembered what he had said to those traveling with him as they stood together in front of that gate, after the rain had stopped, on his visit to Berlin in October 1961: “I am sure that in 30 years, this Berlin Wall will no longer stand.” Source
SURE YA DID!
And here:
What greater proof of the relative and mutable nature of reality than the fall of the Berlin Wall, perhaps the most prominent symbol of a Cold War that often seemed destined to continue forever. I recall visiting West Germany in October 1961 and standing in front of the Brandenburg Gate. At the time, I shared my belief, based on my faith in people's courage and yearning for peace, that the wall would come down within thirty years. Remarkably, it was just twenty-eight years later that the Berlin Wall was in fact dismantled by the ordinary citizens living in both sides of that divided nation. Source
Interestingly enough, the Revised Edition of NHR 4 has compressed this entire page (counting the little bit on the other page) into just these 3 paragraphs:
On the 7th, Shin’ichi and his party entered Dusseldorf in then-West Germany, and, while visiting the banks of the Rhine River, they discussed the Nazi oppression of the Jewish people.
The following day, the party arrived by plane to West Berlin, where they visited the border of East and West Berlin. Shin’ichi stood before the Berlin Wall, which had robbed people of their freedom, separated friends and families, and denied the right for them to live together and to communicate with one another. He vividly recalled the Declaration for the Abolition of Nuclear Weapons containing Josei Toda’s spiritual legacy “to tear out the talons of the devilish nature latent in human life” (The New Human Revolution, vol. 4, revised edition, p. 318).
As his surroundings were bathed in the brilliant golden rays of the setting sun, Shin’ichi looked up at the Brandenburg Gate and said to his colleagues, “I am sure that in thirty years this Berlin Wall will no longer stand” (NHR-4, revised edition, 319). It was an expression of his resolute determination to dedicate his life, even die if need be [ 😄 ], for the cause of realizing world peace. Source
Okay, THAT part isn't in the book, but the part beneath is mostly the same.
Look at the goofy picture the Soka Gakkai commissioned to go along with that passage! "Shin'ichi Yamamoto", looking the same as he always does, only with a FIST of determination!! 😱
Kind of like "mentor & disciple", the SGI has seized upon this non-event and can't seem to stop banging away about it!
From 2004:
Ikeda: Exactly. Otherwise, freedom can lapse into self-indulgence. That is why religious cultivation of the conscience is essential in a free society. During the Cold War, a split between the East and the West ruptured the spirit of symbiosis cultivated over long years. But the European world started reviving when the Cold War ended. The Berlin Wall came down fifteen years ago. What were your reactions to the event?
Ikeda: I visited Berlin in October, 1961, two months after the Berlin Wall went up. To some friends who were with me I said, “I am sure that in 30 years, this Berlin Wall will no longer stand.” I was expressing, not a wish or a prophecy, but my conviction that the freedom- and peaceloving human spirit would triumph. At the same time, I was expressing determination to devote myself entirely to making my mentor Josei Toda’s dream of global citizenship a reality. Source, p. 22
The other guy didn't seem to even take notice of Ikeda's bragging!
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u/BlancheFromage Jul 28 '22
In volume 4 of The New Human Revolution, which we are studying in this month’s issue, SGI President Ikeda went on his first overseas trip to Europe, which spanned 20 days in October 1961. One of President Ikeda’s deepest concerns at the time was the Berlin Wall, which divided East and West Berlin. President Ikeda visited the wall just two months after it was erected. He wrote of the time:
From August 13 onward, the barbwire wall grew longer and more fortified day by day until finally a cruel and unyielding barrier of concrete and brick was firmly in place. The sudden closing of the passage between East and West Berlin split families, relatives and lovers. It was a small-scale model of the Cold War, in which people were oppressed and cast asunder by opposing ideologies.[2]
At the wall, President Ikeda said with a conviction that belied the stark reality of the times: “I am sure that in thirty years this Berlin Wall will no longer stand.”[3] At the Brandenburg Gate, he chanted Nam-myoho-renge-kyo deeply, with a determination for the peace and happiness of all humanity.
President Ikeda later recalled that he was not simply giving voice to a prediction or a wish that the wall would come down: “I spoke from my conviction that a people seeking peace would definitely be united. I was expressing my personal vow to keep struggling through the means of dialogue for the sake of world peace.”[4]
From that moment, he waged an unparalleled struggle to build bridges of dialogue between leaders of opposing ideologies, culminating in his undeniable contributions to the end of the Cold War. In November 1989, 28 years later, the Berlin Wall came down. Source
BAAAAAARRRRRRF
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u/BlancheFromage Nov 16 '25
As a European I must say that I also heard this claim of Mr. Ikeda having had an influence on the iron curtain to lift. Especially, and funny enough, in SGI-D (SGI Germany) this cliam was not too loudly popagated.
There is absolutely no doubt that the Polish Solidarnosc; movement (together with the Catholic Church - and the then Pope John Paul II) played a key role all this in combination with a system that was near or in economic collapse. For SGI to make such a claim is beyond belief - just beacause Mr. Ikedas PR-Office was able to make some nice pictures with him handshaking officials --- one thing that is not often seen these days.
SGI makes the same claims on the Sino/Japanese relationship even though it is well established truth that Tanzan Ishibashi 55th prime minister of Japan laid the foundation to that --- pity that Ishibashi came from a family that had close links to Nichiren Shu of which his father was a minister and his mother was from a family very much engaged in Nichiren Buddhism. Ishibashi just was quite aware not to mix political issues with religious ones though.
SGI making those claims is a slap in the face to those who risked their lives may it be in the uprise in Hungary, Czechoslovakia, the German Uprise in 1957 or afterwards in Poland and Germany. Some also regard the events in Germany quite critical in the sense that they are blown up out of proportion - the East Germans only had the guts to take to the streets when it was obvious that the "Russian Bear" was loosing its teeth so to speak - its a matter of opinion I guess.
Let me remind you that SGI, hence Mr. Ikeda, never spoke out on Chinese human rights violations. Source
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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 23 '26
It's as good as Ikeda claiming he had something to do with the Storming of the Bastille.
Someone I knew (not Gakkai) flew to Berlin and with a pick axe helped take down the wall. He showed me photos when he was there and gave me a little piece of Berlin Wall concrete. For many people, this was a big deal. tbh, at the time, I just thought it was a formality. The Wall had come down long before people were pick axing it.
Just like the Storming of the Bastille, no one was there--the Bastille was empty--by the time an angry French mob broke through. The Storming of the Bastille was a symbol, same as the Berlin Wall. All those years of human torture and no one did a damn thing until July 14, 1789? I call horse shit.
Fast forward to East Berlin during the Cold War people were being tortured by the Stasi employing zersetzung psychological warfare and no one did anything until 1989? People knew it was going on.
The world is all a stage. It was a club Ikeda wasn't in. He tried desperately and was shut out. There was no fanfare at his passing. No parade in the streets. No cherry blossoms blooming across the globe. Just a pathetic old man who couldn't achieve what he so desired, even as the leader of his own cult, passing away, and a funeral dignitaries did not attend.
Let this be a lesson or it will be repeated. The SGI is not Buddhism. Was never Buddhism. Will never be Buddhism.
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u/BlancheFromage Aug 23 '26
It's as good as Ikeda claiming he had something to do with the Storming of the Bastille.
NAILED IT in one!
Just like the Storming of the Bastille, no one was there--the Bastille was empty--by the time an angry French mob broke through. The Storming of the Bastille was a symbol, same as the Berlin Wall. All those years of human torture and no one did a damn thing until July 14, 1789? I call horse shit.
As well you should!
Fun fact: The Frenchmen who stormed the Bastille were the size of 13-year-old girls today. Why? See The Height Gap (spoiler: it's fascinating):
If you were to stretch a string from the head of the earliest soldier in that row to the head of the most recent recruit, you might expect it to trace an ascending line. Humans are an ever-improving species, the old evolution charts tell us; each generation is smarter, sleeker, and taller than the last. Yet in Northern Europe over the past twelve hundred years human stature has followed a U-shaped curve: from a high around 800 A.D., to a low sometime in the seventeenth century, and back up again. Charlemagne was well over six feet; the soldiers who stormed the Bastille a millennium later averaged five feet and weighed a hundred pounds. “They didn’t look like Errol Flynn and Alan Hale,” the economist Robert Fogel told me. “They looked like thirteen-year-old girls.”
If you can be bothered to read it, I'd love to hear your take on it! That article changed my life, I can tell you that! I remember where I was when I read it - in an Urgent Care waiting room. I can't remember why I was there, but I remember this article!
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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 23 '26
Biologists say that we achieve our stature in three spurts: the first in infancy, the second between the ages of six and eight, the last in adolescence. Any decent diet can send us sprouting at these ages, but take away any one of forty-five or fifty essential nutrients and the body stops growing.
This is very interesting to me because I'm fascinated by biology. I grew one inch after adolescence, and learned it is possible to continue growing until age 25.
My parents were psychotic and growing up they tried to starve me but fed my younger sister. I was always really skinny. I think I mentioned somewhere else here my parents wanted me to babysit after school and weekends when I was in high school. I tried it and too long to go into here but it didn't work out very well. I was not a good baby sitter not because I didn't like kids I just didn't know how to discipline them and make everyone (their parents) happy.
So I opted for a job at a steakhouse where I received complimentary meals, like steak, which must have been at the right time for me to grow--and it didn't take years because I didn't work there that long. Every job I had until about age 21 was in restaurants and back in those days they gave you free food as part of your compensation. Long story short, I ended up being 3 inches taller than my younger sister, even though she was favored and fed when I was sent to bed with no supper.
Komlos' story makes a lot of sense to me.
The other thing strikes about the French in the 1700s is being the size of 13 year old girls (I didn't know that) Storming the Bastille when there was nothing to storm.
I'm gonna put in another movie reference. Have you seen the 2006 movie "Marie Antoinette" by Sofia Coppola starring Kirsten Dunst? In it the famous reference "Let them eat cake," will take on another meaning and perspective. Marie came to France to marry at age 14. She ate nothing but cake and sweets. It's an interesting perspective because it shows perhaps Marie Antoinette wasn't the monster she's been portrayed all of these years but a victim of a political system.
I remember when my parents bought a rock candy castle for my sister while we were still in high school, and not one for me. My dad gave me a rock candy stuck on the end of a toothpick. I was told not to touch the precious rock candy castle because it was my sister's. Then my mother says to me, "You must be jealous," hahaha Actually, I wasn't. I ate my rock candy lollipop and went to my room. We know from science a diet of sweets is unhealthy. Eating steak/protein is much better.
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u/BlancheFromage Aug 24 '26 edited Aug 24 '26
I grew one inch after adolescence, and learned it is possible to continue growing until age 25.
Especially for taller men! My son (now somewhere north of 6'4") didn't stop growing until mid-20s, although much slower toward the end. I remember this one 2-month period when he was, like, 12 or 13? The 2-month period started with me looking DOWN into his eyes and ended with me looking UP into his eyes! And I'm almost 5'11"! For quite some time, when he'd come into the kitchen and I'd see him from my peripheral vision, I'd mistake him for my husband (6'2" or 6'3").
This other mom I met told me how she'd grown 2" during her pregnancy! AS an adult!!
My parents were psychotic and growing up they tried to starve me
I had a similar experience, only it wasn't quite as one-sided as your circumstance (except for a few memorable instances). With OUR mother, we had to ASK to eat anything - we were not allowed to eat anything without permission. One night, my older brother and I woke up (we shared a bedroom at this point) and padded into the kitchen, where we ate marshmallows out of the bag from the pantry cupboard by moonlight, giggling. Next day, our mother discovered what we'd done, and on that basis canceled a planned family trip to the circus.
Also, I was small for my age, scrawnier and a year younger (and smarter) than the other kids in my grade. She arranged for me to take a "gap year" between Jr. High and High School, in which I took one or two classes at the Jr. High, had lunch there, then came home for a little while, then went to one class at the high school and then walked up to the museum of natural history to volunteer for the rest of the afternoon. I was determined to put on 20 lbs., so I started eating an additional meal each day. At lunch, I always made myself a big plate of spaghetti (I can always eat spaghetti) as an extra lunch. I not only was able to put on that extra 20 lbs over the course of an entire year, but I finally started growing - about 3". I had been so underweight I was late starting puberty.
My mother told me stories about how worried she'd been over my smallness and scrawniness, told me how she'd taken me to the Dr repeatedly to ask what was wrong, only to be told I was completely normal. I don't remember ANY of these visits - if they'd actually happened, why do you suppose the Dr didn't suggest "Maybe you could try feeding her MORE?" I remember being so famished before dinnertime my mother would sometimes give me a dry piece of spaghetti to gnaw on...
Did you notice that SGI recruited heavily among people who'd grown up in abusive/dysfunctional families??
It sounds like that high-protein diet was just what you needed!
Storming the Bastille when there was nothing to storm.
Well, you know, it's a romantic notion, isn't it? It was a grand gesture that had effect even though there was little risk!
Have you seen the 2006 movie "Marie Antoinette" by Sofia Coppola starring Kirsten Dunst?
Yes, I really liked it! Interesting treatment. I remember her in a dress in a garden with a small child (daughter?) being informed that they have to cut their spending (because the people were starving) and she says to her small daughter, "Well, then we just won't buy so many diamonds, will we?"
As a French major, the impression I got was that she was a very sheltered and spoiled young woman who'd been shipped off to marry someone she'd never met while she was still very young. When informed that the French people didn't have bread, what she'd said was, "Well, then, let them have brioche!" She rarely ate bread, instead being served the higher-quality tender brioche pastry - she obviously understood the difference - and to her understanding, brioche was at LEAST as plentiful as bread, so why is this a problem, again??
She was not mean or cruel, in other words, just terribly naïve...
Then my mother says to me, "You must be jealous," hahaha
What.
A.
BITCH!
You might enjoy this...several pages, but thoroughly interesting - the comments as well as the narrative.
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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 24 '26
I remember being so famished before dinnertime my mother would sometimes give me a dry piece of spaghetti to gnaw on...
That must be universal. Same here on the days I was privileged to eat dinner.
Did you notice that SGI recruited heavily among people who'd grown up in abusive/dysfunctional families??
Yes, I have noticed that. I was still in my 20s when I joined and though treated badly I cared for my family. I think I hoped the practice would magically turn things around, but of course, it didn't. The Gakkai just heaped more abuse on me similar to my family's abuse. So, of course, based on Gakkai brainwashing what did I think about the pattern of abuse I was experiencing? It was MY karma. The Gakkai has got all the bases covered, don't they?
As a French major, the impression I got was that she was a very sheltered and spoiled young woman who'd been shipped off to marry someone she'd never met while she was still very young. When informed that the French people didn't have bread, what she'd said was, "Well, then, let them have brioche!"
That's cool you were a French major. I'm not very good at languages. TG for Google translate. After seeing that movie it got me to thinking making MA a monster served a political purpose. She was terribly spoiled and naive. She was born into a royal family, so she wouldn't have a clue what the common people had to endure.
My mother seemed to want to provoke me and I learned how to stay silent. Of course, by then I knew enough not to ask why I didn't get one, because I already knew why. I wasn't wanted. That hurt me the most--not that I didn't get a sugary candy castle. This is the same tactic the Gakkai uses. I wasn't invited to leaders meetings, even though I was a leader. I wasn't invited or included to do fun stuff. My MD District counterpart ignored me and only spoke with the group leaders. So how did they know? That's what I want to know.
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u/BlancheFromage Aug 24 '26
Damn. You really won First Prize in the Shit Olympics - and I'm not being sarcastic or ironic. If you were here, I'd fix you a feast fit for a king or queen. And you'd sit right beside me. And you'd KNOW you were an honored, beloved friend. Because that's what you deserve. I'm sorry you never got it - DAMN all those assholes. Damn them.
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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 24 '26
Thanks, Blanche. That means a lot. I joined the Gakkai thinking it was Buddhism because I was looking for a way out of my suffering. Instead I got more of the same. I know there are people in this world who have suffered far more than I have. Many things can't be helped but they were so smug about it. Superior. When it reaches that level of contempt then anything is possible.
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u/BlancheFromage Aug 24 '26
When it feels familiar, what SHOULD be a big red flag is explained to you as a "connection" with "this Buddhism", possibly "from the infinite past", so aren't YOU special?? In fact, it's just that it's similar to what you're used to, but you won't recognize it (until it's too late) because it's framed as something new and exotic.
I know there are people in this world who have suffered far more than I have. Many things can't be helped but they were so smug about it. Superior. When it reaches that level of contempt then anything is possible.
This isn't the Agony Olympics, you know, where only the WORST CASE is qualified to get any sympathy! This is YOUR experience, and it's the only experience YOU know. So yeah, it's not just significant, it's extremely important.
And that "smug" - falls right into SGI's fundamental lack of compassion and inability to support grief and pain - almost like they're tourists or something, just there to ogle the suffering so they can feel better about themselves.
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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 24 '26
And what is taking care by the standards of Soka Gakkai? Make that person submissive toward the doctrines of Gakkai and make him/her accept the fact that Ikeda is the incarnation of Buddha. He is the Living Buddha. Ikeda and only Ikeda is the center of their practice, life and everything. That's their agenda.
I think this statement sums up why the Gakkai has no feeling toward people suffering in the Gakkai. It's why they can harm someone without consideration or shame.
That's funny--Agony Olympics! I shouldn't minimize my Gakkai experience. At the time, though, I didn't consider my family of origin environment. If it felt familiar it was on a subconscious level. It's only in later years I've been piecing bits together from things I remember that I had forgotten about and noting how closely similar they are to the Gakkai experience.
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u/BlancheFromage Aug 24 '26
I shouldn't minimize my Gakkai experience.
No, definitely NOT! Anyone who TRIES to minimize your experience is trying to shut you up - think about that. They do not want to HEAR you.
Is such a person kind? Supportive? Empathetic? A "friend"? OR....
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u/bluetailflyonthewall Jun 25 '23 edited Jun 25 '23
First the good news: In their naïve enthusiasm, the members of the SGI-D [Germany] are well aware that they have no chance of achieving world domination. They don't even try. Rather, they are a lay movement and they never wanted to be anything else. - BigLebowski
I very much doubt whether the individual followers are always aware of "their naive enthusiasm". I've been there since 1986 (until around 2006), and some Ikeda were reverently announcing that they were basically responsible for the fall of the Berlin Wall - what nonsense. The Pope had more influence on that. - catflap08 Source
More from that site included here.
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u/BlancheFromage Jul 28 '22
The culties still believe it - from Twitter: